Do you believe in UFOS?

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Do I believe in UFO's? No. I believe in life.

Post by -mik- » Sun Jun 26, 2005 1:51 am

I don't believe in UFOs. However, I do believe that there is intelligent beings out there with space craft able to travel light years in seconds. But I don't believe that they have come to our planet. Why would they? Why would they waste there time on a regressing civilisation that can't see past war and hate. Such an intelligent species would not bother with our migar world.

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Post by Twitch » Sun Jun 26, 2005 2:14 pm

Maybe they'd come here just to see why some folks are overwhelmed and negative as you are.
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Post by CaptSyf » Sun Jun 26, 2005 2:41 pm

I too don't believe that any non-terestrial beings have been to earth, or Sol for that matter. Using math as a way of proving it, the only way they could have been here, is if they are native to a planet fairly close to our star system (within a few hundred lightyears). Then you have to throw in the possibilty that we may be the most advanced race in the galaxy at this time. After all, Even if an alien race is in our own backyard, they may not engage in conflict the same as we do. War is what pushes man to improve technology. Every major key invention known to man was because of war. If you take a species, and they do not war within themselves, then they will achieve technology on a much slower rate of progress, if any at all. If the other species out there are a completely non-combatant type civilization, then the only improvements they will make is to feed their species as it grows. BUt to reach space, you have to build rockets. To do that, you have to have a motivation other than the desire to see the moon. If you want Nuclear power, you have to build a bomb. The nuke is the most basic use of nuclear science. Using nuclear science for power generation and other less destructive reasons are 10 times harder to develope then the Bomb. I am sure this reasoning also applies to FTL. So, if there is a race with FTL, them we better get to that technological level before they find earth. If not, then is is reasonable to consider that they would be aggressive, and either conquer and enslave us, or be more like the ID4 (the movie) aliens, that just want our planet for it resources, and we are not a resource.
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Post by blindeye01 » Sun Jun 26, 2005 2:56 pm

I saw a UFO once. It was gray and shaped like a cigar that was fat in the middle. It had fins at one end, and something like a basket on its belly. It made a constant humming sound, and had a message for all the people of earth, predicting a bright future. It said "goodyear!"

Seriously though, they might keep an eye on us, but the odds of life having interstellar travel are too great for me to seriously believe in ufos. Is there other life out there? Most likely yes. Can it get here? Most likely no.
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Post by CaptSyf » Sun Jun 26, 2005 3:08 pm

Looks like you and I agree then Blindeye.

Now on a side note, it is possible (a very thin possibility) that we would be the first species outside their star system they encounter. In which case, they may find us a curiousity at first. In which case, then it is presumable that they may take a less aggressive standpoint towards us. But, if that were the case, then we are doomed for the fact that most people could not handle the fact that there are aliens. I am speaking of this planet's political, religious, and military leaders. This would cause us to blatantly attact them when we do discover them "watching" us. In which case, they would deem us a threat to their existance, and destroy this planet (on a genecidal level). The only why that would not happen, is if the right people were in control of the nations, which is not, nor ever has been, the case.
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Post by blindeye01 » Sun Jun 26, 2005 5:23 pm

<img src="http://img40.echo.cx/img40/4426/iwanttobelieve8df.jpg">

It is so funny I had to post it
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Post by -mik- » Mon Jun 27, 2005 12:33 am

CaptSyf wrote:I too don't believe that any non-terestrial beings have been to earth, or Sol for that matter. Using math as a way of proving it, the only way they could have been here, is if they are native to a planet fairly close to our star system (within a few hundred lightyears). Then you have to throw in the possibilty that we may be the most advanced race in the galaxy at this time. After all, Even if an alien race is in our own backyard, they may not engage in conflict the same as we do. War is what pushes man to improve technology. Every major key invention known to man was because of war. If you take a species, and they do not war within themselves, then they will achieve technology on a much slower rate of progress, if any at all. If the other species out there are a completely non-combatant type civilization, then the only improvements they will make is to feed their species as it grows. BUt to reach space, you have to build rockets. To do that, you have to have a motivation other than the desire to see the moon. If you want Nuclear power, you have to build a bomb. The nuke is the most basic use of nuclear science. Using nuclear science for power generation and other less destructive reasons are 10 times harder to develope then the Bomb. I am sure this reasoning also applies to FTL. So, if there is a race with FTL, them we better get to that technological level before they find earth. If not, then is is reasonable to consider that they would be aggressive, and either conquer and enslave us, or be more like the ID4 (the movie) aliens, that just want our planet for it resources, and we are not a resource.
Interesting denotion about the slow progress of aliens because of the lack of war. However, you have based your findings on the Human effort to progression. If we had done it differently, worked together instead of fighting, then the effects wil have been faster. Just because we have not seen aliens first hand, does not mean they do not exist. Imagine what scientists used to say in Greek times, when a revolutionary person came along. "There is no such thing as 'atoms' we can not see them, therefore they do not exist!". If we put this little problem of not believing without pure reason behind us, then we will overcome many problems in life. Remember the blind. They can not see, but things still exist.

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Post by CaptSyf » Mon Jun 27, 2005 3:06 am

I do believe in the logic of math. Using math, one can come to the conclusion that life does exist outside of earth. . However, my personal deductions suggest to me that the most likely cases of higher intelligence suggests that there are the 2 major, and one minor type of species out there. Of coarse, this is all based on humans. But actually, it is based on all species of life that we know. To expect life out there to be similar to here, one need only to look at all known life. I base my ideas on the fact that all species on earth are aggressive, for the majority of the part. I do also take into other traits of the species of life on earth. We have no other model of life to go by, so we must do our best to understand what we may face, before we face it. For when the day comes that the human race is face to face with another species of higher intelligence, we have to be able to understand it. If we react the wrong way, then it will spell doom for us.

Now, this is just how I see it. No one has made these conclusions for me, these are my own ideas.
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Post by Zered003 » Mon Jun 27, 2005 3:11 am

blindeye01 wrote:I saw a UFO once. It was gray and shaped like a cigar that was fat in the middle. It had fins at one end, and something like a basket on its belly. It made a constant humming sound, and had a message for all the people of earth, predicting a bright future. It said "goodyear!"

Seriously though, they might keep an eye on us, but the odds of life having interstellar travel are too great for me to seriously believe in ufos. Is there other life out there? Most likely yes. Can it get here? Most likely no.
Isn't that the same UFO that I saw a news report about it crashing? In Florida I think. Here in the last week or two. They claimed there were 2 pilots and they both survived the crash.
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Post by Zered003 » Mon Jun 27, 2005 3:48 am

Ok, I found pics! 5 of them.

First a Before shot: 8O


then an After shot:


This was the location of the "pilots":


Here is a map of the crash site and some info on the "UFO":


And finally, proof that the US Government may have been behind it the whole time:



lol....that is to funny. :lol: :lol: 8)

Thanks to ImageShack for Free Image Hosting

But seriously, noone died as a result of this so this joke is all in good fun.
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Post by Twitch » Mon Jun 27, 2005 11:15 am

It's amazing to me how smug and predictable human intellect can be. At various stages of our technological advance we stopped and pondered things and concluded that something was impossible. Then someone invented or did that impossible thing.

If we take any of today's conveniences and imagine a time when they did not exist, anyone imagining such things then could never have believed they'd exist one day. If we could go back in time and explain the technology to the scientific minds of yesteryear they would understand the principles involved. Our brains are the same ones the 1st Cro-Magnons had. We don't have any greater capacity for learning than folks did 12,000 yeras ago.

People of past time rejected every invention or informational breakthrough of these times as outlandish. In the early 1800s scientific minds believed that if railway vehicles ever attained 30 MPH all the air would be sucked out of a coach and riders could not survive in that vacuum. Funny, huh?

Every generation at their zenith has swaggered about beating their chests at their intelligence and achievements. They were top dogs, smartest of the smart of anyone or anything that had come before. So if we peer back a mere 200 years we can laugh our asses off about how naive these simpletons were.

They certainly never could have imagined satellites launched into the heavens via massive and thundering rockets so people could verbally and visually communicate to any point on Earth, which was flat, of course.

Nuclear power was a near myth that no one understood in 1900. By 1950 is was the real deal. In 1950 lasers were tantamount to silly sci-fi death rays. By 2000 they are in daily use in myriad ways from blasting attacking air or space vehicles or improving sight throught surgical use.

So when we say that it is impossible for us to travel to vast distances to likely-inhabited places of the universe simply because WE don't know how to do it yet, does NOT mean that someone else cannot do it. It's right up there with saying "Man will never fly," in 1805. Think about it.
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Post by blindeye01 » Mon Jun 27, 2005 11:16 am

Thats funny, but I think my poster put it best about aliens
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Post by Zered003 » Mon Jun 27, 2005 11:37 am

That goes right along with the experts saying man would not be able to learn how to fly for thousands if not millions of years. Then a few weeks later was the first flight ever.
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Post by blindeye01 » Mon Jun 27, 2005 11:52 am

This is a different barrier though. Light speed is a speed limit and all the ways iof getting around that require an entire sun's worth of energy at least to go anywhere. Even if they did have interstellar travel the expense in energy to send a ship to another star would be too great to waste it on visiting Earth, as the trip in all likelihood would have to be a one way trip to the stars.
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Post by Twitch » Mon Jun 27, 2005 12:03 pm

There was a time in the world when there were men of stoic nature who believed fervently in their individual countrys' sovereignty and almost blindly followed those beliefs. When told to do or not do something they didn't question it. They obeyed.
These were the military men of all nations during the last mid-century.

They didn't rat out the supply officer who "liberated" things so his platoon could have the very best then get on the Geraldo show and make a few bucks along with 15 minutes of fame.

It is puzzling that men at the end of their lifetimes on earth who were life-long, staunch military personnel would suddenly make up cryptic references to things they saw or experienced decades earlier but were forbidden to ever speak of by superiors.

Why are they compelled on their deathbeds to discuss alien encounter events instead of love for family and friends? Why would the man who was documented as the B-29 pilot that actually did fly from Roswell, New Mexico to Datyton, Ohio tell his wife as he lay dying that he transposted small alien creatures and their vehicle parts after denying it for a lifetime?

Why would the commander of Roswell Air Base tell his daughter on his deathbead only after relentless probing by her about the facts simply say "creatures" when she asked what they encountered in the scenario of the incident?

He put it all in perspective when she asked why he never said anything before. His reply was, "Because I personally promised President Truman I wouldn't." How many other men that knew things had this same mindset?

See that's what military men used to be. They'd accept torture to the death even when interregators knew the answer of what airbase they came from or whatnot. It was their ehthics and code of honor. The race with the undertaker is a losing one. For all the incidents where facts were known by men and never made public we can never guess.

I have a buddy that was in nuke boats in the late 60s. That's nuclear submarines. Even when drunk he'd never tell how deep they could dive even long after documentaries had disclosed data from declassified sources.

Geez, I was a recon Marine in Vietnam. I was never told that at some specific time in the future I could tell where my squads had clandestinedly ingressed into so-called non-combatant countries to the west of Vietnam. You can figure it out easily but I never told you!

It all simply boils down to whether you believe the government. Well, do you? Why should you with the track record they have?
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