Galaxy Map Size

Galaxy Map Size; support/discussion/questions

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DCER
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Post by DCER » Tue Jun 09, 2009 6:00 pm

Here are the parameters that control the small map view.

Code: Select all

Alignment multipliers:

0xd9ad4, 0xda7ff, 0xdb110, 0xdb3c6

Sector size:

0xdb69b, 0xda2a5, 0xdaf60, 0xd9b71, 0xda4c0, 0xda75a, 0xdafa9, 0xdb01a, 0xdba0c
They were pretty close to the large map view settings for the various galaxy sizes.

With setting these you can control the zoom level of the small map view.

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Post by jonboylondon » Tue Jun 09, 2009 6:52 pm

A trully great discovery regarding the size there...one that will make playing the big maps more enjoyable....

Well Done :P

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Post by thunderchero » Tue Jun 09, 2009 7:24 pm

prefect timing DCER, I have been look foward to this, :wink:

this will make viewing large maps much easier.

I just tested and setup UDMIII3.0.0bdev4 to use this so large exe will have 25x18 small view 8O

edit; after testing small view has problems selecting and viewing system stats with any ship in system. and stopping movement of a ship is very hard to do.

Icons are the problem here mainly ship icon. other can be changed easy by changing name of files and adding them back into stbof.res.
affected tga files.
bid.tga, bie.tga, bif1.tga, blkhmap.tga, mov.tga, mov_.tga, mov_e.tga, mov_w.tga, mov_s.tga, mov_n.tga, mov_ne.tga, mov_nw.tga, mov_se.tga, mov_sw.tga, nsmap.tga, rplsmap.tga, s-b-map.tga, s-g-map.tga, s-o-map.tga, s-r-map.tga, s-w-map.tga, s-y-map.tga, wormmap.tga, xp-map.tga
all of the files above have a counter part in stbof.res that all end with s.tga for small images.
so extract all *****s.tga and remove the "s" and add them back into stbof.res.

problem file are;
i_c26.tga, i_f26.tga, i_h26.tga, i_k26.tga, i_m26.tga, i_r26.tga, ufo_26.tga. these files are shared in several locations. if image size is changed crash to desktop.

I think the code is in wdf files but there are many file to look though. also found many entries in trek.exe for i_c26.tga (if I remember right some one said trek will use "c" and replace it with race that is selected) so may need a combo of changes to make icon smaller.

will keep everyone updated on progress.

thunderchero

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Post by jigalypuff » Wed Jun 10, 2009 2:36 am

There are two ways to resize images in botf :)
Actually resize the entire image, result crash :)
Resize only the icon, ensure the background is that pink color (can`t recall the actual numbers for it) then it will be rendered transparent, hey presto a smaller icon :)

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Post by DCER » Wed Jun 10, 2009 4:55 am

Neat trick, Jig :) This should work well, since botf even ignores clicks on transparent parts of buttons (these icons function also as buttons and can be clicked to select the fleet).
thunderchero wrote:(if I remember right some one said trek will use "c" and replace it with race that is selected)
This is only the case if a percentage sign is in front of it and is code depandant. %c is a single character, %s is a string, %d is a decimal number... http://www.cplusplus.com/reference/clib ... io/printf/

Botf just calls the print function and passes arguments to it, the % entries in the string just tell the print function how to interpret the arguments and where to insert them into the string.

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re

Post by thunderchero » Thu Jun 18, 2009 11:49 am

thunderchero wrote:I did quick test this morning and no luck with smaller icons with pink (ff00ff) background I still able to select background area. :cry:

I also tried no icon with pink background only with same results, I could select ship but nothing else on map in that sector.
Hi everyone,

still no luck with small view, Only a small increase can be made and still allow it to be useable as of right now.

mentat noticed in UDMIII3.0.0a that all the minors were placed to the left.
Gowron had this problem some time ago when editing minors. So I searched most the night and found code in Galaxy Control Values

This problem does not happen unless reference value is set high for more system on map as in UDM "25%"
The value at position
0x17D668
which controls the number of minor races seems to determine the chance that a given sector get a minor race during the placement of the races.

Apparently the sectors are scanned from left to right:
With the value set to 1.0, I observed a definite general accumulation of the minor races in the left part of the map.
vanilla value is A9 99 99 99 99 99 C9 3F (0.2)
for small changes in reference value
new value A9 99 99 99 99 99 B9 3F (0.1)
for 25% like UDM
new value BA 49 0C 02 2B 87 B6 3F (0.088) "UPDATED"

thunderchero
Last edited by thunderchero on Sun Jan 03, 2010 3:46 am, edited 6 times in total.

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Post by Gowron » Sat Jun 20, 2009 7:45 am

thunderchero wrote: vanilla value is A9 99 99 99 99 99 C9 3F (0.2)
for small changes in reference value
new value A9 99 99 99 99 99 B9 3F (0.1)
for 25% like UDM
new value A9 99 99 99 99 99 A9 3F (0.05)

thunderchero
Be careful with such drastic changes, as you might get too few minors this way. The density affects all size/frequency settings, so maybe you want to do a few test games and check the actual number of minor races on the map. Just as a precaution ;)
A discovery consists in seeing something everybody has seen and at the same time thinking something nobody has thought yet.

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Post by thunderchero » Mon Jun 22, 2009 12:12 am

Gowron,

Thanks for the warning about minor race placement 0.088 was lowest value and still get 29 minors regularly :wink:

this is with 52x39 507 systems 0.95 star frequency on irregular other types depending on shape will be less but spread from left to right correctly :wink:

thunderchero

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Post by Tethys » Thu Oct 15, 2009 12:57 pm

i believe ive found the best value for 75x55 maps...

at 0x17D668

replace

A9 99 99 99 99 99 C9 3F

with

FF FF FF FF FF 00 AA 3F

this gives a variable of 27 - 30 minors per large map spawn and the minors are (usually) perfectly spaced...

medium map spawns around 24 - 26 minors

small has yet to be tested...
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Image
GALM <--- GALM/Galaxies Mod

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Post by Tethys » Sun Oct 25, 2009 4:38 pm

wicky82432 wrote:
thunderchero wrote:UE will set sectors to numbers not letters. you should use UE to edit larger galaxies.

check this tutorial out

https://www.armadafleetcommand.com/botf/ ... ial-for-ue

thunderchero
thanks again thunder i totally missed the button to transfer the letters to numbers, ok now heres a even dumber question, why is 75 by 55 as big as you guys have found to work so far? if the maps to big does the game crash or is it that if you go bigger the higher number turns can take forever to process?
well the largest 'stable' map tested and works almost flawlessly would be 52 x 39, I found that map a bit small (for my tastes) so I looked over the chart and found one that looked good and was still playable with minimal crash-while-loading... and I found the 77 x 55 to be that 'one' which I like :)

And yes both of the points you expressed in your recent post are correct; crashing and lagging would increase as map size increases.
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Image
GALM <--- GALM/Galaxies Mod

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Post by Dafedz » Tue Oct 27, 2009 8:15 pm

Although I love playing a large map now, has anyone else discovered that, due to the ponderously slow rate that the AI develops the rival empires it can be hundreds of turns until you even meet them?

In the large map size for BoP mod I've experienced several games in a row where I've maxed out everything I can, reached tech-10, all my favourite ship types have come and gone, and yet I've not fought a single battle, because the other empires are so far away, and far smaller (slower to expand) compared to me - as if the Ai does not know that the map is so much bigger now, and it can explore so much further. This is the only downside (other than the lack of a 'medium' zoom option).

Anyway I do have a couple of bugs to report for these large maps. One is this:

Image

As you can see the sector on the map (7.1) appears empty. However it supposedly contains a system (Tanuga as it happens, a replacement race for the Takarans from UM4).

A little further across (in the top left hand corner in fact) there appears to be an errant star system, whose star is rendered on the far left edge of the map, and is listed as 'Tanuga', yet in system view below the sector is empty.

Image
One other problem I've found. The determined position of Minor races across the map is heavily prejudiced to the left hand side. I once started a game with the home system in the far upper right. I am not slow to expand. I systematically explored hundreds of sectors, and charted a total of 68 systems before I discovered my first Minor race. And that was turn 281. The entire right hand side was empty of them.

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Post by thunderchero » Tue Oct 27, 2009 8:32 pm

Hi Dafedz,

As for AI expantion yes it is very poor. this might be helped if we had code to set better aggendas. But this has not been found yet.

For your first bug (no display of system) no I had not seen that. Was that map from BOP?

I have not seen the edge problem either. But will keep an eye out for both.

I have noticed more minors on right the code above will help with this but if set too high will cause less minors on map.

here is link to code.

viewtopic.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&p=13384#13384

This is also why I have started making "larger maps" an option for multi installer mods.

I too like larger maps but after many game have found them almost unplayable at times. And lose interest before completing them.

thunderchero

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Post by Dafedz » Wed Oct 28, 2009 6:49 pm

Thanks for the reply thunder. Yes that map is from BoP. I will insert that code and see what difference it makes. What is supposed to happen exactly, a more even spread of minors?

And yes I know what you mean. I relished playing on a larger map, and when the chance came I found that time and again it became a bit boring, as by the time I discovered another empire I had grown so big and powerful that there was no chance of defeat: lack of jeopardy = lack of interest.

What values can be altered/modded to increase the likelihood that empires will expand more aggressively? I'm not sure how to do this, other than perhaps setting their colony and troop ships to long range from the start.

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Post by thunderchero » Wed Oct 28, 2009 8:08 pm

larger values more minors right but too large of value will get less minors than min set value.

Dafedz wrote:What values can be altered/modded to increase the likelihood that empires will expand more aggressively? I'm not sure how to do this, other than perhaps setting their colony and troop ships to long range from the start.
You can try editing How the AI decides what ship type to build But not sure what effect this would have.

Also you could try extending ship range by tech level with UE

I think more system help so outposts are not needed as much.

But none have been test too much yet. :wink: I have made all these changes in UDMIII.

thunderchero

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Post by Dafedz » Thu Oct 29, 2009 3:12 pm

Thanks for that. Another thing I've always noticed about botf, is that Ai empires virtually never fully develop a newly settled system. Examining the systems of an empire I find that most have only 1 or 2 planets terraformed, and support populations often less than a hundred.

This greatly stifles their total economic and industrial strength, thus impacting development.

It would be great if there was a modding trick to force the AI to fully terraform a system before colonizing it. Then such empires would perhaps be a lot stronger and more challenging.

viewtopic.php?f=9&t=1131

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