Star Frequency

Star Frequency; support/discussion/questions

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Re: Star Frequency

Post by thunderchero » Thu Sep 25, 2014 11:26 pm

Wilhelmina wrote:I even tried to open exisiting mods to look into those configurations with UE but this wont let me (protected?),
no mod is protected.
Wilhelmina wrote:but I still have a lot of empty Sectors on a 52x39 map.
on 52 x 39 = 2028 sectors so 625 star names is way too low to fill map.

I hope you are using UE to edit galaxy maps and using this tutorial.
large-map-generation-chart-and-tutorial-for-ue

but what it sounds like you are trying to do will cause 5 min turn time by turn 20 and will increase after that, so by turn 200 it may take turn process time to over 1 hour :shock: (never tested but that's what I would expect)

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Re: Star Frequency

Post by Wilhelmina » Fri Sep 26, 2014 6:26 am

Yes , I used the Tutorial , since the UE was first introduced. I mod from time to time this game, since something new was found an I tried that and this (allways with a clean vanilla Backup , for mistakes and so on)

I dont want to have it all filled with star systems, but some more stars would let it look less empty .

I even try the Settings at those positions which were made in UDM (at 0xAFA94 and 0xAFA49 : C2 01 (450) ) but it still looks way too empty . Or should I put in because of 59x32 an equal of 1888 ?
I admit I am puzzled here, in how to increase the count of star systems in game.



What I mean with protected, UE wont open the stbof.res from those mods (I have lots of dev versions and some stable ones till the latest 7.1b I guess). I have to unpack the files I want to edit and incorporate them into my vanilla stbof. The trek.exe is just editable via Hex Editor


A next question comes up for me. When I try to alter my map ingame to place specific minors next to Empires , is there still the bug of multiple 1-per-Empire-buildings ? I experienced it in the past, when DCER was still active, it allways occured when I tried to move ships as well. Or can I prevent Minor sips from start? Because that would give me at least an alternative in creating a Galaxy with normal shapes or Star Density.

Thanks in advance for your patience :)

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Re: Star Frequency

Post by thunderchero » Fri Sep 26, 2014 7:50 am

Wilhelmina wrote:I even try the Settings at those positions which were made in UDM (at 0xAFA94 and 0xAFA49 : C2 01 (450) ) but it still looks way too empty .
positions 0xAFA94 and 0xAFA49 does not tell me much you need to also post what these position do.
Wilhelmina wrote:UE wont open the stbof.res from those mods
UE open all stbof.res, only thing I can think of mod needs to be installed first
Wilhelmina wrote:I have lots of dev versions and some stable ones till the latest 7.1b I guess
UE 0.7.2dev5c should be only version used.
Wilhelmina wrote: When I try to alter my map ingame to place specific minors next to Empire
give this up it will always cause errors. any editing of saved games will always be a bad thing to do.
Wilhelmina wrote:is there still the bug of multiple 1-per-Empire-buildings ?
with limiting home system size (larger than any possible system) and a lot of editing of AI building requirements it can be lessened.

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Re: Star Frequency

Post by Wilhelmina » Fri Sep 26, 2014 9:21 am

positions 0xAFA94 and 0xAFA49 does not tell me much you need to also post what these position do.
Gowron wrote:apparently, the game has run out of system names (or slots of some kind), and the bottom area is completely empty.



The star system limit is found at position 0xAFA49 and at position 0xAFA94.

2 bytes signed = 32767 systems max. Default 0xE6 (230)

Note changing of the limiting value at both positions is needed!


It is believed to avert:

NOTE: If starname.bin runs out of names game will crash or freeze during map creation.

taken from the first page of this thread.

I thought this has something to do with the thing I wanted to accomplish, since its in this topic .

A few more Systems on my map, would be awesome.



At altering the Savegames, I follow the advice DCER gave me years ago, IF altering the save, then in turn 1.

I might aks you one additional question, beacause search isnt helpfull there too. I wanted to reduce starting ships to 0 , and force empires to develop from scratch , like its a colony :D

Any hints ?

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Re: Star Frequency

Post by thunderchero » Fri Sep 26, 2014 11:03 am

those values should be edited by UE when you change "avg number of space objects" but you should double check this :wink:

but what UE does not edit is this;
thunderchero wrote:First this is not a stable map size and should not be used.

max stable size found so far is 52x39

to increase systems on map requires starname.bin to have enough system.

next at 0x17D568 is Galactic Density value (4 bytes float) default is 500.0
this value can be change (image below used 1000.0) but generation becomes even more unstable when star/anommoly ratio is above 0.80



You should also read this post and next 4-5 posts
viewtopic.php?f=107&t=618&p=13384#p13384
you need to play with this value testing different values until you get minors spread properly across map
Wilhelmina wrote:At altering the Savegames, I follow the advice DCER gave me years ago, IF altering the save, then in turn 1.
it may be the best time but still after time you will get errors.

example;
you move Vulcans from position 12-34 to 1-1 position. you now see Vulcans at 1-1 but if AI race explores position 12-34 AI still meets Vulcans and sets up trade route to 12-34 and error begins "System is not dest or source of trade route"
this may take 50 turns it may take 100 turns but it will happen.

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Re: Star Frequency

Post by Wilhelmina » Fri Sep 26, 2014 12:01 pm

Did it :)

afg Number of Space Objects was the Point, was locked on 239 .

And I tell you, the trick was to use the UE 7.2dev5c not the 7.1b , because I tried to alter this last night with it and it allways resetted to 239. Even tried to look for the chart in the forums, but now Im enlightened:D



One thing still stays, I cant deactivate a starting shipyrd, and when I try to set starting ships with speed 0 the game crashes after some time. So starting with no ships would be awesome to acomplish my goal to set early as really early (just startet to fly through own Solar System). Any hints on that? I only find a topic which says how to increase starting ships. But I am not good at code analysing, have allways to reread everything when I start to mod again (mostly after I start to watch trek movies and series once per year ) :D

Tried to set the required technology of those ships a bit higher, with this I start without ships, but when I go to shipbuilding, the game crashes

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Re: Star Frequency

Post by thunderchero » Fri Sep 26, 2014 12:36 pm

adding shipyard is part of the basic programming for home systems

I am not sure what you want to accomplish here, you might try some or all below?

you want ships but not able to move?
you want no shipyard but still have ships?
you want no ships and no shipyards?

never tried this but,

use UE/edit/starting conditions/starting buildings
on left plane select shipyard then click remove (this should be done for all races on tech 1 start "beginning")

edit/building/building stats
select each shipyard change to tech level you want available to build ships. (this should be done for all races)

edit/ships/ship stats
edit every ship so no ship/outost is available until tech 2?

next edit/starting conditions/starting technology
select "auto set all"

this way on tech 1 start no shipyards and no ships

will this cause crash you tell us.....

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Re: Star Frequency

Post by thunderchero » Fri Sep 26, 2014 12:59 pm

thunderchero wrote:adding shipyard is part of the basic programming for home systems
one other thing you could do
edit/building/building stats
select basic replicator go to last page you should see shipyards then below that card, fed, fer, klin, rom check all those boxes plus check basic shipyard on left

this way it will place basic replicator instead of shipyard but will effect all start levels

then you should add all shipyard to AI build requirements edit/AI/AI build requirements

also this will greatly hamper AI development.

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Re: Star Frequency

Post by Wilhelmina » Fri Sep 26, 2014 1:25 pm

thunderchero wrote:
thunderchero wrote:adding shipyard is part of the basic programming for home systems
one other thing you could do
edit/building/building stats
select basic replicator go to last page you should see shipyards then below that card, fed, fer, klin, rom check all those boxes plus check basic shipyard on left

this way it will place basic replicator instead of shipyard but will effect all start levels

then you should add all shipyard to AI build requirements edit/AI/AI build requirements

also this will greatly hamper AI development.

thunderchero

Thank You so much :) , this will help to perfect my personal mod a lot more :D

I will fiddle around with that.

If I would know how to incorporate sound files, Pics or even make good uis, I would also try to integrate new factions :D but I guess for that I need more experience later :D

At least one of you Modding Vets is still here :D the code masters all gone? or do they take a break?

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Re: Star Frequency

Post by Wilhelmina » Sat Sep 27, 2014 11:03 am

What Kind of errors could appear, If I place manually the minros ? Are they gamebreaking or cause CTD ? Because I tried a lot now up to turn 700 with such games, but nothing more happened than usual. You just dont have to move ships as well, thats why I asked if there is a possibillity to let minors who can build ships start without.

I noticed ,that if the AI has access to mor minors its expanding wider and faster . and on such large maps its often that at least one Empire starts with no minors in initial range.
I fiddled a bit with the ai map scan matrix
Spocks-cuddly-tribble wrote:Well, I felt it was time to finish this task, thus...


The AI Map Scan Matrix Reloaded :wink:


Code: Select all
41D04F mov ecx, 19h // max distance in sectors to check ?


This has to be equal to the large map horizontal edge (i.e. the largest edge of the exe).

Therewith, hopefully, AI should expand and behave as usual on enlarged maps. :)


Close to this, there is also a float with the same value:

Code: Select all
41D05A push 40390000h (first part of 8 byte float 25.0)


EDIT the 25.0 float has to be changed accordingly (or better set the *colvar.wtf "distance" values to 0.0 for larger maps. This won't help much, however, I made some progress wrt analysing AI map scan. But it's way more complicated than expected, i.e. no publication anytime soon)
Peter1981 wrote:how on earth did you fnd that little gem! -- Great work SCT :D so

at 0x1C450 in trek.exe

change 19 00 00 00
to 20 00 00 00

will work for a map with a horizontal edge of 32.
changed the 20 to 34 for testing, but no difference . But if I place some minors in the initial range of AI Empires, they start much faster in expanding. These must be minors which like the empire also .

So back to my question. How big are those errors ?

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Re: Star Frequency

Post by thunderchero » Sat Sep 27, 2014 11:11 am

for minors not to have ships at tech1 start (beginning) you could try

edit/starting conditions/starting technology then edit each level for minors on "1"

example
acamarians 1 (they are already set to 0 on all tech types)
but
Vulcans 1 is set to 3 on every tech type change each to 0

do this for all minors that are not set to 0 (but only on 1)

then "auto set all" and save

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Re: Star Frequency

Post by thunderchero » Sat Sep 27, 2014 11:22 am

sorry I did not answer your question from your last post.
Wilhelmina wrote:What Kind of errors could appear, If I place manually the minros ? Are they gamebreaking or cause CTD ?
CTD, game will load again, but on press of turn CTD again.

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Re: Star Frequency

Post by Wilhelmina » Sat Sep 27, 2014 12:21 pm

thunderchero wrote:sorry I did not answer your question from your last post.
Wilhelmina wrote:What Kind of errors could appear, If I place manually the minros ? Are they gamebreaking or cause CTD ?
CTD, game will load again, but on press of turn CTD again.

thunderchero

I guess this could run like a wild card. Since I played such games up to turn 700 and more and nothing happened, while other games where I didnt changed the tarting races on other places could crash (of course reload and play further was allways possible)

But I guess the only possibility of an good expanding AI is to place minors next to them , or they have to meet each other, but for this task I have to be near them to, when I shorten the Empire distances :D

Thanks for the tip of the starting tech , I also edited to be most sure the techlevel of the shipyard,which minors use to 2. so they have to evolve too to have ships. Ive seen its possible to make mor types of minor ships building on each other (ie upgrade/refit) so an even progress of minors and their ships could be good.

Will AI build minor ships if I enable them Empire wide?

Thanks for your tips so far (really helfull) :)

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Re: Star Frequency

Post by thunderchero » Sat Sep 27, 2014 1:37 pm

Wilhelmina wrote:Will AI build minor ships if I enable them Empire wide?
if they did it would be a very rare instance. here is how AI decides what to build.

they have a list in trek.exe "AI ship building sets" using current agenda they will use that list. it will build ships 1 by 1 starting at top of that list. if it is a cruiser it starts at top of ship list and the first cruiser that they can build (with proper race id) is the one they will add to build queue. since minors are not their race id it should be ignored.

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Re: Star Frequency

Post by Wilhelmina » Sat Sep 27, 2014 1:47 pm

thunderchero wrote:
Wilhelmina wrote:Will AI build minor ships if I enable them Empire wide?
if they did it would be a very rare instance. here is how AI decides what to build.

they have a list in trek.exe "AI ship building sets" using current agenda they will use that list. it will build ships 1 by 1 starting at top of that list. if it is a cruiser it starts at top of ship list and the first cruiser that they can build (with proper race id) is the one they will add to build queue. since minors are not their race id it should be ignored.

thunderchero

A I thought as much . Because I wanted to be able to build all ships of those races when I conquer them, and make it possible for the empires too. But grinding through the forums and HelpTexts from DCER I found out, that this wuld just affecting the Player.

Is it possible to add "dummy"ships to minors and dont set them to spacefaring to prevent the crash if I enable different Empire Ships?

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