The Daedelus Class
Posted: Tue Nov 29, 2011 10:38 pm
Recently, the Daedelus class of ship has been mentioned on this forum, specifically at
viewtopic.php?f=4&t=2275&p=32120&hilit= ... b2c#p32120
There appears to be some speculation as to where this class of ship actually fits into the scheme of things in the Star Trek universe, and if it is a canon design at all. And what is its relationship with the later Olympic class? (seen in the TNG last episode)?
I’d like to offer some suggestions and comments (as usual try to make some logical sense of it all), and then throw them out there for your dissection and discussion.
So let’s begin.
The problems this class presents are well summarised in an Ex Astris Scientia article, so you are urged to read this first.
http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/artic ... oblems.htm
see also http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/schem ... ships1.htm
This also saves me having to write these up and keeps this article shorter.
(Coincidently, the article arrives at a length of 140m for the Daedelus, which fits well with my suggested length of 140-150m for the NX class, see my article at
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1648&hilit=nx+class. If Earth is producing some of the first Federation ships, then it stands to reason that their first Federation models would be limited to the largest sized ship they could produce at the time.)
A conjectural history of the type is also available at
http://www.daedalusclass.com/ - I stress, this is conjectural (but then again, what isn’t in a science fiction series??)
If we accept the evidence of models seen in various Star Trek series, then the type evidently existed. The time of its service appears to start in the mid 22nd century (2160’s to 2196), so it is a Federation rather than an Earth ship (unless Earth is still making its own vessels after the Federation is formed).
I think, after reading the articles that the crux of the problem, and the solution, with the Daedelus class ultimately comes down to its classification. What type of ship was it, and what was its main role? I’ve seen it variously labelled as a cruiser and an explorer.
If we classify it as a cruiser, we immediately run into difficulties with the NX class. Thanks to ‘Enterprise’, the NX appears as a much more modern type than the Daedelus. Why replace your current cruiser (NX) with a retro looking and presumably less advanced model? And with features (ie spherical hull) that are abandoned in later cruiser types (ie Constitution, Excelsior, etc). If the cruiser designs follow an evolutionary trend from NX to Sovereign (ie flat primary saucers) then the Daedelus becomes a one off anomaly.
If we classify it as an explorer, then what exactly does an explorer do, and when did the classification come into effect? If the function is simply to explore new areas, then any ship class can ultimately do the job if it has to. If an explorer is supposed to be a well armed state of the art vessel designed to investigate distant dangerous unchartered areas and come back in one piece, then again the Daedelus class fails to have the necessary requirements since it neither the most advanced class (as compared with the NX), nor do we have any idea if it has greater range (though judging by the style of nacelle which is the same type as the early Constitution Enterprise in the Star Trek pilot episode this may or may not be the case). And thanks to ‘Enterprise’ with its ‘photonic’ torpedoes and ‘phase’ cannons, I doubt if it is better armed.
Also, given the time period the type appears in (2160’s – the formation of the Federation), is there any need for a dedicated explorer type? After the Romulan War, wouldn’t the main emphasis be on reconstruction, consolidation and ironing out the political problems involved with the merging of various diverse alien governments? Thanks to the new members of the Federation the immediate space in this part of the galaxy would already be well known. The limitations of the then state of the art engine designs (warp 5) would also limit any long range voyages of discovery.
The term ‘explorer’, seems to be pretty broadly defined. Even the Constitution class in TOS was never termed as an explorer class, but as a ‘starship’.
Memory Alpha cites some examples of ‘explorer’ type ships, http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Explorer_ship including the NX class, but all these seem to refer to a ship’s function rather than an actual designated class type. As already stated, any ship can explore. In the article, the actual explorer designation specifically referred to the Galaxy class.
So where does this leave us with the Daedelus?
It doesn’t make sense as a cruiser, since the similarly sized NX adequately fulfils this role (and I know of no period when the Federation fleet had two similarly sized vessels fulfilling the same fleet role). It also comes up short as an explorer, since all the current ship types can fulfil this function, and there is no reason to have a dedicated ‘explorer’ class at this time.
Some would see it as smaller than an NX, and fulfilling a destroyer type role, to the NX cruiser. But the Intrepid class of ships already fill this role in the Earth fleet, and surely it would be more convenient and cost effective to upgrade these when required rather than build a brand new destroyer type like the Daedelus.
Can what we know of the on screen Daedelus missions tell us anything?
Three episodes are said to be specifically associated with the Daedelus class;
TNG Power Play, TOS The Return of The Archons and TOS A Piece Of The Action. But after examining all three, there is absolutely no clear indication as to the type of ship involved.
In TNG Power Play, the Essex, specifically stated as being a Daedelus class vessel, was destroyed by electro magnetic radiation from an M class moon of Ma-bu Six. Since this moon is classed as unexplored in Next Generation times, one might think that it was at the edge of known space in the 23rd century, and therefore would justify an ‘explorer’ label for the Daedelus. But Ma-bu can just as easily be located in known space, and the moon has stayed unexplored for nearly 200 years because the EM storms make it so dangerous. The Daedelus class Essex happened to be caught in the storms at the time, and was destroyed. It could happen to any ship class. So ‘Power Play’ is of no help in identifying the Daedelus ship type. (But we do learn that a Daedelus complement is 229.) http://www.chakoteya.net/NextGen/215.htm
The Return Of The Archons is also problematic. The Archon is never specifically referred to as a Daedelus http://www.chakoteya.net/StarTrek/22.htm,
Let’s turn to TOS ‘A Piece Of The Action’ http://www.chakoteya.net/StarTrek/49.htm
The Daedelus connection with the Horizon in this episode is based on a model seen in Sisko’s ready room, but this may be debatable. http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/schem ... ships1.htm. We don’t know if this Horizon model is the one mentioned in the episode.
The following dialogue occurs in the episode.
KIRK: Yes. Unfortunately, the Horizon was lost with all hands shortly after leaving your planet. We only received her radio report last month.
OXMYX [OC]: Last month? What are you talking about? The Horizon left here a hundred years ago.
KIRK: Difficult to explain. We received a report a hundred years late because it was sent by conventional radio. Your system is on the outer reaches of the galaxy. They didn't have subspace communication in those days.
KIRK: The Horizon's contact came before the Non-Interference Directive went into effect.
MCCOY: They must have interfered with the normal evolution of the planet.
SPOCK: It will be interesting to see the results of the contamination
http://www.chakoteya.net/StarTrek/49.htm
If we assume that this Horizon is a Daedelus class ship, what can we learn here?
Firstly, there is no indication in the episode just what the Horizon’s mission was, so we can’t work out what type of ship it is. One might argue that the term ‘on the outer reaches of the galaxy’ might indicate a great distance from the Federation and hence an explorer class ship, except that Earth is also on the outer reaches of the galaxy (on a spiral arm) and in any case a ship of one hundred years ago is not going to go very far from its bases. Since the cultural contamination was an accident, it also cannot give us any clues as to the ship’s mission.
So, once again, we are at a dead end.
What of the connection between the Daedelus and Olympic classes? As Bernd Schneider in Ex Astris Scientia has stated …
“there is no good reason to assume that the explorer of the Daedalus class and the 200 years younger hospital ship of the Olympic class should be in any way related just because they both have a globular main hull.”
http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/artic ... oblems.htm
That is very true. There is currently no on screen connection between the two at all. But I would argue that precisely because these are the ONLY two ships in the whole franchise which have round primary hulls, some relationship between the two exists.
Let’s go back to the time period of the Daedelus’s appearance (2160’s). We have already discounted a cruiser or explorer role for the type. What other new class of ship would be required? Earth had suffered the earlier Xinti attack, and has been decimated by the recent Romulan War. The Federation is being formed. The main emphasis would be on recovery. Casualties need to be treated and infrastructure rebuilt, not just for Earth, but for their newly formed Federation partners. A dedicated medical vessel would seem like a desperately needed addition to the fleet.
“Enterprise” has shown, thanks to their Denobulan doctor, that an Earth ship can successfully treat alien patients. Might a new Earth built medical ship, the Daedelus class, cement the Earth’s position in the new Federation by healing the wounds of the other member worlds? Perhaps the Denobulans had a hand in its development and construction. Who knows, maybe Phlox was the Daedelus’s first capatain! The Round primary hull might provide more rooms for beds and laboratories, a feature inherited by the Olympic. Maybe the Horizon in TOS ‘A Piece Of The Action’ was on some medical mission.
If we accept the working hypothesis that the Daedelus class is a medical vessel, what are the implications? Firstly, that there is a whole unseen lineage of this type of ship stretching from the beginnings of the Federation (Daedelus) to the 24th Century (Olympic).
Secondly, in BOTF game terms, it gives the Federation a new tool for not only recovering quickly, but for enticing new members into its ranks. You no longer have to wait till the TMP era to speedily rebuild/remake your planetary systems with a Genesis torpedo. You now have hospital/medical ships that can start immediate treatment.
And as for the diplomatic side of things, using a hospital ship to cure a plague on a minor’s planet may be the equivalent of a few thousand credit bribe. Medical ships not only provide resiliency in the face of attack, but diplomatic benefits.
Well, those are my thoughts on the matter. Let the discussion begin!!!!!!!!
viewtopic.php?f=4&t=2275&p=32120&hilit= ... b2c#p32120
There appears to be some speculation as to where this class of ship actually fits into the scheme of things in the Star Trek universe, and if it is a canon design at all. And what is its relationship with the later Olympic class? (seen in the TNG last episode)?
I’d like to offer some suggestions and comments (as usual try to make some logical sense of it all), and then throw them out there for your dissection and discussion.
So let’s begin.
The problems this class presents are well summarised in an Ex Astris Scientia article, so you are urged to read this first.
http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/artic ... oblems.htm
see also http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/schem ... ships1.htm
This also saves me having to write these up and keeps this article shorter.
(Coincidently, the article arrives at a length of 140m for the Daedelus, which fits well with my suggested length of 140-150m for the NX class, see my article at
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1648&hilit=nx+class. If Earth is producing some of the first Federation ships, then it stands to reason that their first Federation models would be limited to the largest sized ship they could produce at the time.)
A conjectural history of the type is also available at
http://www.daedalusclass.com/ - I stress, this is conjectural (but then again, what isn’t in a science fiction series??)
If we accept the evidence of models seen in various Star Trek series, then the type evidently existed. The time of its service appears to start in the mid 22nd century (2160’s to 2196), so it is a Federation rather than an Earth ship (unless Earth is still making its own vessels after the Federation is formed).
I think, after reading the articles that the crux of the problem, and the solution, with the Daedelus class ultimately comes down to its classification. What type of ship was it, and what was its main role? I’ve seen it variously labelled as a cruiser and an explorer.
If we classify it as a cruiser, we immediately run into difficulties with the NX class. Thanks to ‘Enterprise’, the NX appears as a much more modern type than the Daedelus. Why replace your current cruiser (NX) with a retro looking and presumably less advanced model? And with features (ie spherical hull) that are abandoned in later cruiser types (ie Constitution, Excelsior, etc). If the cruiser designs follow an evolutionary trend from NX to Sovereign (ie flat primary saucers) then the Daedelus becomes a one off anomaly.
If we classify it as an explorer, then what exactly does an explorer do, and when did the classification come into effect? If the function is simply to explore new areas, then any ship class can ultimately do the job if it has to. If an explorer is supposed to be a well armed state of the art vessel designed to investigate distant dangerous unchartered areas and come back in one piece, then again the Daedelus class fails to have the necessary requirements since it neither the most advanced class (as compared with the NX), nor do we have any idea if it has greater range (though judging by the style of nacelle which is the same type as the early Constitution Enterprise in the Star Trek pilot episode this may or may not be the case). And thanks to ‘Enterprise’ with its ‘photonic’ torpedoes and ‘phase’ cannons, I doubt if it is better armed.
Also, given the time period the type appears in (2160’s – the formation of the Federation), is there any need for a dedicated explorer type? After the Romulan War, wouldn’t the main emphasis be on reconstruction, consolidation and ironing out the political problems involved with the merging of various diverse alien governments? Thanks to the new members of the Federation the immediate space in this part of the galaxy would already be well known. The limitations of the then state of the art engine designs (warp 5) would also limit any long range voyages of discovery.
The term ‘explorer’, seems to be pretty broadly defined. Even the Constitution class in TOS was never termed as an explorer class, but as a ‘starship’.
Memory Alpha cites some examples of ‘explorer’ type ships, http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Explorer_ship including the NX class, but all these seem to refer to a ship’s function rather than an actual designated class type. As already stated, any ship can explore. In the article, the actual explorer designation specifically referred to the Galaxy class.
So where does this leave us with the Daedelus?
It doesn’t make sense as a cruiser, since the similarly sized NX adequately fulfils this role (and I know of no period when the Federation fleet had two similarly sized vessels fulfilling the same fleet role). It also comes up short as an explorer, since all the current ship types can fulfil this function, and there is no reason to have a dedicated ‘explorer’ class at this time.
Some would see it as smaller than an NX, and fulfilling a destroyer type role, to the NX cruiser. But the Intrepid class of ships already fill this role in the Earth fleet, and surely it would be more convenient and cost effective to upgrade these when required rather than build a brand new destroyer type like the Daedelus.
Can what we know of the on screen Daedelus missions tell us anything?
Three episodes are said to be specifically associated with the Daedelus class;
TNG Power Play, TOS The Return of The Archons and TOS A Piece Of The Action. But after examining all three, there is absolutely no clear indication as to the type of ship involved.
In TNG Power Play, the Essex, specifically stated as being a Daedelus class vessel, was destroyed by electro magnetic radiation from an M class moon of Ma-bu Six. Since this moon is classed as unexplored in Next Generation times, one might think that it was at the edge of known space in the 23rd century, and therefore would justify an ‘explorer’ label for the Daedelus. But Ma-bu can just as easily be located in known space, and the moon has stayed unexplored for nearly 200 years because the EM storms make it so dangerous. The Daedelus class Essex happened to be caught in the storms at the time, and was destroyed. It could happen to any ship class. So ‘Power Play’ is of no help in identifying the Daedelus ship type. (But we do learn that a Daedelus complement is 229.) http://www.chakoteya.net/NextGen/215.htm
The Return Of The Archons is also problematic. The Archon is never specifically referred to as a Daedelus http://www.chakoteya.net/StarTrek/22.htm,
Let’s turn to TOS ‘A Piece Of The Action’ http://www.chakoteya.net/StarTrek/49.htm
The Daedelus connection with the Horizon in this episode is based on a model seen in Sisko’s ready room, but this may be debatable. http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/schem ... ships1.htm. We don’t know if this Horizon model is the one mentioned in the episode.
The following dialogue occurs in the episode.
KIRK: Yes. Unfortunately, the Horizon was lost with all hands shortly after leaving your planet. We only received her radio report last month.
OXMYX [OC]: Last month? What are you talking about? The Horizon left here a hundred years ago.
KIRK: Difficult to explain. We received a report a hundred years late because it was sent by conventional radio. Your system is on the outer reaches of the galaxy. They didn't have subspace communication in those days.
KIRK: The Horizon's contact came before the Non-Interference Directive went into effect.
MCCOY: They must have interfered with the normal evolution of the planet.
SPOCK: It will be interesting to see the results of the contamination
http://www.chakoteya.net/StarTrek/49.htm
If we assume that this Horizon is a Daedelus class ship, what can we learn here?
Firstly, there is no indication in the episode just what the Horizon’s mission was, so we can’t work out what type of ship it is. One might argue that the term ‘on the outer reaches of the galaxy’ might indicate a great distance from the Federation and hence an explorer class ship, except that Earth is also on the outer reaches of the galaxy (on a spiral arm) and in any case a ship of one hundred years ago is not going to go very far from its bases. Since the cultural contamination was an accident, it also cannot give us any clues as to the ship’s mission.
So, once again, we are at a dead end.
What of the connection between the Daedelus and Olympic classes? As Bernd Schneider in Ex Astris Scientia has stated …
“there is no good reason to assume that the explorer of the Daedalus class and the 200 years younger hospital ship of the Olympic class should be in any way related just because they both have a globular main hull.”
http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/artic ... oblems.htm
That is very true. There is currently no on screen connection between the two at all. But I would argue that precisely because these are the ONLY two ships in the whole franchise which have round primary hulls, some relationship between the two exists.
Let’s go back to the time period of the Daedelus’s appearance (2160’s). We have already discounted a cruiser or explorer role for the type. What other new class of ship would be required? Earth had suffered the earlier Xinti attack, and has been decimated by the recent Romulan War. The Federation is being formed. The main emphasis would be on recovery. Casualties need to be treated and infrastructure rebuilt, not just for Earth, but for their newly formed Federation partners. A dedicated medical vessel would seem like a desperately needed addition to the fleet.
“Enterprise” has shown, thanks to their Denobulan doctor, that an Earth ship can successfully treat alien patients. Might a new Earth built medical ship, the Daedelus class, cement the Earth’s position in the new Federation by healing the wounds of the other member worlds? Perhaps the Denobulans had a hand in its development and construction. Who knows, maybe Phlox was the Daedelus’s first capatain! The Round primary hull might provide more rooms for beds and laboratories, a feature inherited by the Olympic. Maybe the Horizon in TOS ‘A Piece Of The Action’ was on some medical mission.
If we accept the working hypothesis that the Daedelus class is a medical vessel, what are the implications? Firstly, that there is a whole unseen lineage of this type of ship stretching from the beginnings of the Federation (Daedelus) to the 24th Century (Olympic).
Secondly, in BOTF game terms, it gives the Federation a new tool for not only recovering quickly, but for enticing new members into its ranks. You no longer have to wait till the TMP era to speedily rebuild/remake your planetary systems with a Genesis torpedo. You now have hospital/medical ships that can start immediate treatment.
And as for the diplomatic side of things, using a hospital ship to cure a plague on a minor’s planet may be the equivalent of a few thousand credit bribe. Medical ships not only provide resiliency in the face of attack, but diplomatic benefits.
Well, those are my thoughts on the matter. Let the discussion begin!!!!!!!!