Ultimate Dominion Mod III - Beta Info

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nightman
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Post by nightman » Sun May 11, 2008 4:18 am

Hi I hope someone can help me. I was playing the mod and I was on turn 28 I believe and everything was going good but I was looking at the research management and the game crashed. This is the error message I got: It was a Trek.exe App Error it had (0xc0000008) occurred in application at location 0x7c964ed1. Could someone help. This is a great mod and I haven't played this in years and I fogot how much I loved this game. Keep up the good work!

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Post by alekssandros » Sun May 11, 2008 5:21 am

I question me about if U can put mor class ships on game? ^^

Like Soyuz and New Orleans :D

And there are so much out, poor them hehehehe

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Bert
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Post by Bert » Sun May 11, 2008 7:17 am

its just a random crash nightman i think there has beene some other repsosne to similar prblems in the thread i suggest you look at thtose or jus ttake it very slowly when looking at the research manangmeent list someitmes jumping quickly from ship to ship can cause problems

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Post by crashpm » Sun May 11, 2008 7:38 am

@ locutus, i actually did a side by side comparison of the ships and on paper, the Sovereign is completly outclassed by the Dominion, klingon and Romulan Dreadnuaghts. Of course theyres probably some hidden advantage like maneuverability i didnt test. otherwise all the enemy ships have more hull, more shields and damage output. by some decent margins too. althoguh the cardassian ship does have slightly less dmage output.

also i did not note industry build costs or maintainence in this comp heh

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Post by ZeroChance » Sun May 11, 2008 10:43 am

@Siggi regarding ship stats/battles

Just before your post I fought a battle T5 as Cards against Feds. They outnumbered me around 40 ships to 25 plus an outpost. The only advantage I had was that my cruisers and fast attack were highly trained, and the feds were mostly regular/green.

Long story short, I won the battle after 15 turns and having destroyed all the Fed ships minus a few destroyers. I finished with 3 Keldons without sheilds and 3/4 to 1/2 hull left. The remaining destroyers retreated. I really doubt a battle of this magnitude would have played out exactly the same with more Vanilla stats...

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Post by sean_west » Mon May 12, 2008 2:19 pm

Can I suggest a change to the Dominions,

The building which allows special ship building, could it be changed to something like "Worm hole". This way, the Dominion would get their best ships from the gamma quadrant, and since planet 6 is a worm hole it would sit great.
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Post by Locustus » Mon May 12, 2008 9:03 pm

I've often wondered what "builds special ships" means.

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Post by toroca » Tue May 13, 2008 12:28 am

It means certain ship classes can only be built in a system that contains that structure. Like in vanilla, with Utopia Planitia.

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Post by matress_of_evil » Tue May 13, 2008 6:16 am

It's not just one system toroca, it's ALL systems. In vanilla, the Federation can't build any of its' advanced ships (Galaxy-X, Sovereign, Defiant) without first building Utopia Planitia. These designs don't even appear in the build list for any of your systems unless it has been built. The structure doesn't need to be powered, but it must have been built.

If you scrap the structure, or it's destroyed through bombardment, terrorism, or sabotage, you will again lose the designs from your shiplist until you have built the structure again.
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Post by siggi » Tue May 13, 2008 12:19 pm

Locustus wrote:Thanks for the attention :)

I think you might try to encourage a new BOTF game and find a way to take part in creating the official game. It could be much better than modding (since I am looking at this, it is still very interesting as is). It would certainly become stable and ulock many things.
Lol, I don't know about thunderchero, but I certainly don't have the skills nor the time to encourage any such feat (neglecting that there probably wouldn't be anyone listening...) So, if you wanna see all new BotF games, I'd recommend you taking a look at BotE and Supremacy, both are very promising fan-made sequels to BotF.
Locustus wrote: For example, I don't have access to all energy powered buildings because they don't have room on the display and I can't power them up. Also, orbital batteries have always annoyed me and with 25 of them, I'd probably need 10 battleships to bombard a system only to kill most of it. I couldn't even get 3 of them to destroy batteries when there were 3 batteries.
Well, the first problem should arise only in the respective home-systems, other systems should be fine. UDM III has much more special structures than vanilla BotF. For future updates, there are two possible solutions: Reducing the number of special buildings again, or reduce the number of buildings that are already built upon start-up of a new game. If the 'invisible' structures are build manually and there is sufficient power available, they should be powered up and everything should be fine.

As to the Orbitals: That's not a bug. They were meant to be tough, much tougher than in vanilla BotF. Invasions should be major efforts, and be done easily with a couple warships and a dozen transports.
Locustus wrote:Also, strike cruisers seem useless for planetary assault. Can anyone tell me how they are special for it? Can you tell me how planetary assault works? I want to know everything :D . Damage ships take, what anti ship defense means, why there is an alien called orbital battery and a building with the same name, and finally about ground combat. I do know that orbital batteries will attack one ship each in the order you told them to attack, each task force being taken in its order. And if one of the ships dies it moves on to another. How the "alien" orbital battery's stats work along with weapon technology: do the weapons fire once a map turn, multiplied by tech? How the shield generator affects things (and why it doesn't help with aliens).
To find answers to all of these questions, I shamelessly refer you to Gowron's posts. I think he addressed every topic, and I certainly don't know more than he does about the game's mechanics. In modding this stuff we used his findings as a starting point and took off by trial-and-error.
Locustus wrote:I think strike cruisers should be a much better thing for assaults than command ships. I don't know if you can mod that. Fire from outside the battery range.
You will notice that Strikers in UDM III have a much greater weapons range than in vanilla, thus they should behave the way you suggest ;-).
Locustus wrote:About ships, the battleships/dreadnoughts seem terribly overpowered, although slow, considering their build cost and maintenance.
What happended to the supremacy of the Heavy Escort? I compare it to the Sovereign and find out I have no reason to build it. In edit, it seems to have worse defense (evading power) than DreadnoughtII, it has the same speed, its cost/maintenance does not justify the stat difference.
I also compared ultimate ships from each playable race and I find the sovereign potentially underpowered compared to cost/maintenance Is the shield recharge that good? Or defense? Is it because of speed? Do shields still regenerate after reaching zero in UDM3?
Well, of course the Sovereign is the weakest of all the Tech10 'Uber'-Ships. After all, the Federation is devoted to peaceful exploration and research, thus you shouldn't expect the Sovvies to exceed the brutish qualities of a Dominion Battleship or a Hutet. And the Scimitar was explicitly shown as superior.

The ship stats for UDM III, as complicated as they were calculated, are based on some very generic thoughts: The different ship types are indeed different from one another. A fast attack ship is more agile and generally fast, intended for close-range attack. A cruiser / command ship is the principal warship of a fleet, with strong weapons and strong defense. These carry the mainload of the offensive potential of any fleet. Strike Cruisers have strong, long-range torpedoes, useful for suppressing planetary defenses and long-range supportive action during fleet engagements. Now matter how advanced a ship-class may be, it will still be bound to these basic categories.

The Defianet-class Heavy Escort is a fast attack ship. There are no fast attack ships which are as powerful as contemporary cruisers. Period. In DS9, the Valiant took on a single Battleship and bit the dust. Rightfully so. They are, small, over-powered phaser-batteries with built-in warp drive. They are fast and agile and intended to divert incoming fire from the main cruisers during large battles. In vanilla, the Defiant was blatantly over-done. It has been our aim to make UDM III a little more realistic when it comes to ship stats.
If you're building your fleets by what ship has the biggest bang for the buck, then you may be disappointed of the Defiant, I'll grant that ;-).

Moreover, the different races have different philosophies which reflect in the ships they are building. The stats have been devised to implement this approach.

Nevertheless, the Sovereign will have it's stats spiced up a little bit for the coming update as will the Constitution ;-).

Cheers,
Siggi
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Post by siggi » Tue May 13, 2008 12:20 pm

matress_of_evil wrote:It's not just one system toroca, it's ALL systems. In vanilla, the Federation can't build any of its' advanced ships (Galaxy-X, Sovereign, Defiant) without first building Utopia Planitia. These designs don't even appear in the build list for any of your systems unless it has been built. The structure doesn't need to be powered, but it must have been built.

If you scrap the structure, or it's destroyed through bombardment, terrorism, or sabotage, you will again lose the designs from your shiplist until you have built the structure again.
Quite right. And moreover, the Utopia advantage of building these special ships can't be transferred to an other race. Thus, the wormhole advantage can't be implemented this way, unfortunately.

Cheers,
Siggi
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Post by siggi » Tue May 13, 2008 12:27 pm

ZeroChance wrote:@Siggi regarding ship stats/battles

Just before your post I fought a battle T5 as Cards against Feds. They outnumbered me around 40 ships to 25 plus an outpost. The only advantage I had was that my cruisers and fast attack were highly trained, and the feds were mostly regular/green.

Long story short, I won the battle after 15 turns and having destroyed all the Fed ships minus a few destroyers. I finished with 3 Keldons without sheilds and 3/4 to 1/2 hull left. The remaining destroyers retreated. I really doubt a battle of this magnitude would have played out exactly the same with more Vanilla stats...
Third post in a row... ;-)

I suppose it was your Outpost which let you emerge victorious. The AI always tries to take out the Outpost first, giving you plenty of 'free' shots at their ships.

In one of my own games, I had roughly the same setup, playing as the Feds, defending against a superior Klingon force, consisting mainly of Battle Cruiser IIIs and some BoP IIs. I barely survived with a couple of Galaxys and Excelsiors (game was Tech 3, I think).

If you still got the save game, try to switch sides and play the attack the Feds. You will find that you may be able to win the Cardies out. It all depends on strategy (just they way it's supposed to be... ;-)).

Cheers,
Siggi
...of course, this was also true at the Birth of the Federation...
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Post by toroca » Tue May 13, 2008 12:32 pm

matress_of_evil wrote:It's not just one system toroca, it's ALL systems. In vanilla, the Federation can't build any of its' advanced ships (Galaxy-X, Sovereign, Defiant) without first building Utopia Planitia.
Ah. I thought the advanced ships could ONLY be built at Utopia Planitia in vanilla. But it has been quite a while since I played the Feds, so I guess I mis-remembered.

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Post by matress_of_evil » Tue May 13, 2008 2:13 pm

Grr...I just reinstalled BOTF but I haven't got this mod saved on my computer.

...But I can't download it! I'm getting wierd error messages saying "the connection to the server has been reset" in Internet Explorer. I've tried using a download manager but that just downloads a useless 36kb file and not the rar file, and if I use Firefox I get an error message saying "the file could not be downloaded, because the file could not be read".

Anyone know what might be causing it?
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Post by thunderchero » Tue May 13, 2008 2:55 pm

where are you downloading it from?

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