UDM4 (no longer in development)

Ultimate Dominion Mod; showcase and support/discussion/questions/suggestions/reviews

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Flocke
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Re: UDM4 Ideas, Suggestions... Interest?

Post by Flocke » Sat Oct 01, 2011 9:26 pm

thunderchero wrote:
jigalypuff wrote:I fail to see how anyone but Dafedz can give permission to work on this mod?
I think you are mixing up Ultimate dominion mod III by me, and Ultimate mod 4 by Dafedz. xDx is working on remake from scratch of Ultimate dominion mod.

thunderchero
ROFL, LOL, sorry, just too funny for me right now, nice to see ya back jig, finally xDx gets some more interest in his work on udm4. :lol:
Sorry xDx for not having posted, but I've been quite busy recently, just like many others I think, and havn't played botf at all for many months either.

Just my little experience with udm3, I began to hate huge systems with 500+ population and too many special buildings and over powered minors cause these games become too fast too bombastic. But that's also a problem I have with super large maps and others have different mind.
If you're doing serious work on this mod you'll for sure soon get more interest (maybe after a first pre-release), and also support.

Wish ya a good progress! :)

@Gh0st, want to answer on your 'demand' or wish, well, people always have different mind, different skill, different time management, it's hard to get modders together on one thing. Also there are many n00b modders (actually we all still are noobish in some way) that want to make experiences rather than actually target something specific and you've more freedom when doing something on your own.
Instead of raging, best thing you can do about is start to mod yourself and do better, maybe help organize combining work of different projects.
We all would like to achieve something real great, but although it might take a little longer with the diversity and individualism, I think there's hope cause there's also lots of progress all can benefit from.
Be glad there are still so many active modders and there even still come new ones for this oldish game I tell ya!
Give it a go and try yourself, maybe try to help a project like the one of xDx. ;)

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Re: UDM4 Ideas, Suggestions... Interest?

Post by KrazeeXXL » Sat Oct 01, 2011 10:48 pm

Haven't seen this thread yet. Thx @ Flocke for telling me about it.

xDx, as you asked for something @ wishlist:

Gowron's Upgrade System.

I love his "purified micromanagement". Like Flocke, I dislike this 500+ systems as it's an incredible (boring, repetetive, you name it) work to keep 50 or more 500+ systems organized and upgraded in a quick and efficient way. Gowron solved this problem in a classy manner if you ask me.
Every mod should use this (if it wants to get played by me) ;)

Last year, I decided to take a deeper look onto Gowron's Upgrade System as I wanted to adapt it for UDM3. But I haven't had the time for it yet...

Combining UDM3 and AAM is an ambitious task. A huge one. It's a great goal but it will take some serious amount of time to accomplish it.
I for myself, will have a deeper look at Gowron's Upgrade System and the Random Events, too, in the next time. As a n00b myself, I have to get some skills first, b4 I can offer them ;)

Anyways, if you need some input feel free to contact me whenever you want.

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Re: UDM4 Ideas, Suggestions... Interest?

Post by Darth_Windu » Sat Oct 01, 2011 11:39 pm

I've really never played UDM3, but I do have one suggestion - an accurate Negh'var model. I noticed when creating my own mod (using the UDM3 ship pack amongst others) that the Negh'var in UDM3 is actually a Voodieh.

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Re: UDM4 Ideas, Suggestions... Interest?

Post by carcher » Wed Oct 05, 2011 4:41 pm

I ve missed this thread completely! glad i stumbled upon it :D
you have some great ideas here, xdx, to take UDM even further is a noble cause :) great stuff.As a few ppl said the idea of auto upgrades, especially in the super large map,is good it can be a pain keeping track of everything when you really just want to hit the turn button and invade a cardie system.your idea of an augment minor system ( or even a monster) is brilliant :D ( seeing a bunch of klings getting kicked around in ENT by a few " humans" was superb)
i cant think of anymore minors you could add at the moment, but one question- if your empire runs into a nasty minor at tech level 1 will you survive? lol
I really hope you get this finished it would be a great addition to the site and i'm sure a very,very popular game for us all to play in sp and hopefully mp,dont give up
keep the faith :D
for the world is hollow and i have touched the sky....and one day mickar.....one day.....one sweet day......HAS ARRIVED!! HAPPY DAYS :D

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Re: UDM4 Ideas, Suggestions... Interest?

Post by JadesBack » Mon Dec 19, 2011 8:38 am

If you can make it as MP friendly as possible it would make me very happy :)

Im interested

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Re: UDM4 Ideas, Suggestions... Interest?

Post by xDx » Tue Dec 20, 2011 10:35 am

Hi Jadesback,
Yes I was actually toying with the idea of making two versions like UDM3 and UDML versions except mine would be UDM4 and UDM4MP version. Basically anything to make the mod more MP realistic like lower poly models, smaller maps, phantom dilithium (if needed by then), 100% ship scrapping, faster build times etc. If you have any good suggestions please feel free to PM them to me. As for everyone else I thank you for giving me attention in this post and sorry I have not posted anything sooner. My free time has been spent helping others in what limited capacity I can to bring their projects closer to completion. So yes everyone any ideas and personal wishlists you would like to see in UDM4 please post them here or pm me with your ideas as I am now hoping to have a beta done within the next couple of months :)
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Re: UDM4 Ideas, Suggestions... Interest?

Post by SOTHIronhide » Sun Feb 12, 2012 1:56 am

Hi,

i´m for Balancing by the great Races and balancing by the Ship Klass.
Pleas make the big ships not to heavy. 3-5 destroyer must need to destroy a cruiser and 2-3 cruiser for a battleship.
The last version is very nice and thanks for making :)

greets to all

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Re: UDM4 Ideas, Suggestions... Interest?

Post by rasiom » Tue Dec 25, 2012 12:13 pm

HI

what is the status of UDM4 now?
I hope we can download the first version soon :).
I realy love UDM3 and im still playing it with my friends.
I think the Outposts and Starbases are overpowered. 25 Destroyer cant kill an Outpost O_o.
And a Star Base is almost imortal^^.
Also the ships got too much live. Cloaked ships are just too weak. 1 more round is not enough becasue the ships got too much shields.
The 1 that play Romulans or Klingons loose the most of the games.

Rasiom

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Re: UDM4 Ideas, Suggestions... Interest?

Post by zozozo » Tue Dec 25, 2012 9:14 pm

if they ever make another UDM, i hope they de-neuter minor race ships. when they used to be strong i never had my game ruined by "mean minors". so idk why it was changed. it's not canon and it's less interesting. you can barely kill scouts with some minor race ships (e.g. t'lani, xindi, etc). they're so inaccurate, and do little damage when they hit. if you fight manually you'll be there 10+ mins, zooming in each turn

also, i hope they return the raptor class model for the klingons and the old romulan bird of prey. i know it's pre-24rd century/TNG, but at tech 1 the game starts with the players only having left their homeworld. so it fits in with the period. and non-feds have so few models in comparison

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Re: UDM4 Ideas, Suggestions... Interest?

Post by adi » Wed Dec 26, 2012 12:36 pm

the original star bases in UDM3d are not that powerful; but you can not hope to take them down with scouts and destroyers; use some cruisers and be sure you are at about the same tech level or above and then the outposts and star bases are just free xp points. In my game I made them much more stronger and still can be defeated with minimum losses but you need at least 10 cruisers of the same tech level. I would make them even stronger but the dumb AI gets decimated by them.

It is true that all minor ships are useless for combat; but you still have options regarding them; I scrap them for money but if you want to keep them the use UE and change there stats; the same advice goes if you think that other ships are too week or too powerful; by using UE you can tailor the mood to your liking; and it even lets you add new ship models. and much much more... it just takes some time to find out what you can do with it.

viewtopic.php?f=4&t=22&sid=92f55267818d ... 4838b0#p49

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Re: UDM4 Ideas, Suggestions... Interest?

Post by Antni » Tue Jan 08, 2013 11:37 am

I was wondering if there was any way in which an empire could ask for membership to another empire? Say for example i can't remeber where i heard it but i have this feeling that someone said by the 26th century the klingons were part of the federation so i thought it would be cool if an empire could become a member and their territory would then turn blue and you gain all its science, money, ships etc but them asking for membership would be rare or a hard thing to do.
"Speak for yourself sir I plan to live forever" Cmdr William Riker.

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Re: UDM4 Ideas, Suggestions... Interest?

Post by zozozo » Wed Jan 09, 2013 9:11 pm

being able to have relationships with breakaway colonies

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Re: UDM4 Ideas, Suggestions... Interest?

Post by Dafedz » Thu Feb 21, 2013 8:26 pm

thunderchero wrote:
jigalypuff wrote:I fail to see how anyone but Dafedz can give permission to work on this mod?
I think you are mixing up Ultimate dominion mod III by me, and Ultimate mod 4 by Dafedz. xDx is working on remake from scratch of Ultimate dominion mod.

thunderchero
Indeedy, the two are not the same. But I am touched that peeps here still remember me! :)

So how's the project for UDM4 going? You know, releasing an updated UM5 has crossed my mind. I already have it to be honest, which I play occasionally but haven't released. It's actually really awesome, because it's quite hard! A proper challenge. Just yesterday I lost Yridia to a Cardassian taskforce comprising of 465 ships! Ouchie.

But modding has moved on a long long way since me and Jig were playing around with it (before the days of UE even). I'm still proud of what i was able to contribute to proceedings though, in producing the first new ship model for the game that was solid (separated with planes), and fully textured. The advances since have been mind-boggling.

But I have to be honest and say, that for me a new mod just can't cut it unless these things happen:
-New minor race slots added (more than the current max of 30).
-New buildings for those races.
-The complete elimination of end-game turn lag (memory leak, as far as I'm aware impossible to fix without source code)

Is it at all feasible that new minors can be added beyond the current 30? Is anyone working on it?

If such problems can ever be cracked, then dang, it will almost be a BOTF2, which we've waited for forever. Until then, think I'll sit on UM5. Because, as great as many of these new generation mods are, it's just changes to the scenery, a few more bells and whistles, but the extreme limitations of the original (15 yr old code) remains.

But I'm watching Quasardonkey's thread with interest. This for me is the real way forward.

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Re: UDM4 Ideas, Suggestions... Interest?

Post by thunderchero » Thu Feb 21, 2013 8:50 pm

Nice to see you back,

let me know if you change your mind, I am always able to create an installer for you.

thunderchero

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Re: UDM4 Ideas, Suggestions... Interest?

Post by Flocke » Fri Feb 22, 2013 6:36 am

Hello Dafedz,

welcome back and a great honour to be visited by you modding veteran!
Cool you're thinking about modding on BotF again. Very cool indeed. :D
Dafedz wrote:But I have to be honest and say, that for me a new mod just can't cut it unless these things happen:
-New minor race slots added (more than the current max of 30).
-New buildings for those races.
-The complete elimination of end-game turn lag (memory leak, as far as I'm aware impossible to fix without source code)
You don't make it easy. :lol:
Dafedz wrote:Is it at all feasible that new minors can be added beyond the current 30? Is anyone working on it?
Let me put it different. While indeed we can *work* on these points, it is still a long way to go. Actually there are many ways and often you better work on something different first.

Let's check your points.
  1. New minor race slots:
    There are several limits of botf dealing with minor races. First there is the hardcoded value of 30 minors which should be possible to break with some brute force. I am not sure what attempts have been taken to increase that value.
    But then there's also the two 32bit race bitmasks which limit to 64 - 5 = 59 minors and is used for offset calculation in many places I think. This might be possible to cave and reimplement, but would mean alot of work for sure.
    Beside that it could be attempted to reimplement minors completely, but then we need new menus for interacting with them, a new network engine to handle user input in mp, new map rendering to show them all correct, new evolution code and if they have ships also combat calculation eventually if not more.
    At current time I think reimplementing minors is no good option. There are just too many side projects it involves.
    So best attempt right now is to try maximize to 59.
  2. New buildings for those races:
    The building limit recently has been cracked I think. This should make no trouble.
  3. The complete elimination of end-game turn lag:
    As far I know, in the main this is related to AI ship movement. It needs to calculate what to do with it's ships and does so pretty dumb.
    This is a very good point for reimplementation as it wouldn't even require a new network engine or something. We just need to block current implementation and run our own to give ships orders and move on the map. The only task here is to implement some better and more performant AI calculation. I wonder why noone came up with that a proposal for extension yet. :D
    Actually we can reimplement most of the turn processing if not all by some analysis.
Dafedz wrote:If such problems can ever be cracked, then dang, it will almost be a BOTF2, which we've waited for forever.
With some more C++ coders working on it we'd get ahead mush faster. :)
Dafedz wrote:Until then, think I'll sit on UM5. Because, as great as many of these new generation mods are, it's just changes to the scenery, a few more bells and whistles, but the extreme limitations of the original (15 yr old code) remains.
Comeon, if we all just keep sitting on our work we'd get nowhere. Limitations will continue to fall. Alot fall down over the years already.
Dafedz wrote:But I'm watching Quasardonkey's thread with interest. This for me is the real way forward.
Yeah, well, redoing all is fine but so much of work... :roll:

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