BOTF 2?

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JeanNYGUARD
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BOTF 2?

Post by JeanNYGUARD » Mon Nov 02, 2009 6:29 pm

OKay Ive been struggling with a question.

Because nearly all of The BOTF 2 projects has stalled or cancelled I started thinking of speaking to CBS / Paromount. I have a contact there whos in charge of Star Trek Gaming. Im considering proposing a idea to her suggest a brand new PC title that will be Birth of The Federation 2.

Im hoping to setup a meeting, present why BOTF 2 would be a hit, and hope for the best.

What do you guys think? Is it time we go to the big wigs?

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Post by jigalypuff » Mon Nov 02, 2009 6:52 pm

Mikes project is still ongoing jean, why do you think it`s stalled?

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Post by corestandeven » Mon Nov 02, 2009 6:54 pm

While i'd love a BOTF2, and have wanted a official sequel for years, I dont think its a possibilty and I'd think no developer would touch it. Why?

i) Botf1 wasn't that popular even 9 years ago, and didnt score that high in reviews. It is a cult game really, with a small following.
ii) Star Trek games of late have mostly been about nice graphics and simple gameplay than in-depth strategies, I dont see that trend changing.
iii) Turn bases games (sadly) are not popular. Only big titles with well established fan bases would have a chance, and even then they aren't that popular.

I'd love to be proved wrong though!!! :D

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Post by JeanNYGUARD » Mon Nov 02, 2009 8:11 pm

jigalypuff wrote:Mikes project is still ongoing jean, why do you think it`s stalled?
Mikes Project is progressing, slowly cause hes a very busy man, but its going to be a while. We still have the AI, Diplomacy restructure, Tactical ingame element and its incorporation, and then Beta.

I just think perhaps if CBS Paromount is aware of The BOTF community, and BOTF 2 projects... that perhaps they will endorse and possibly fund a project.

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Post by ruthlessferengi » Mon Nov 02, 2009 9:50 pm

JeanNYGUARD
i don't think it is going to hurt to talk to these guys, i'd say go for it:)

it is a cult, true, lets get some converts:)
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Post by dx_chaos » Tue Nov 03, 2009 3:41 pm

JeanNYGUARD

I say go for it! There is certainly an army of potential beta testers out here! :wink: 8)

Good luck

Chaos

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Post by anjel » Thu Nov 05, 2009 1:59 am

I like the idea, and there could be more of us arund the wolrd, that we had expected. For example i´m from Argentina (South America).
So i say GO FOR IT !!!

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Post by Sarakash » Fri Nov 06, 2009 6:20 am

Sadly, corestandeven is right, but anyway, i would give it a try.

Maybe this isn`t representive, but i know some people which are still in turn-based strategy games like Botf or MOO2.
I even managed to convince my neighboor to check out birth of the empire and he likes it. :)

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Post by Tethys » Fri Nov 06, 2009 1:13 pm

How long has AFC's BotF site been around? If it has been since the beginning of the BotF 'era', and we have over 8000 members, that translates into roughly 800 members each year, or 2.1 members per day.

Just think of all the people who don't even know this site exists... and I think 8000+ signatures on a petition document would be enough to pass for an official BotF 2 game to be at least 'brought to the table' so to speak...

Anyone up for signing a petition for an official BotF 2 release?

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Post by eber3 » Fri Nov 06, 2009 1:24 pm

Ok, I don't want to sound like I'm complaining. I'm just a little disappointed with the progress on the two version of BOTF2. The one looks good but is progressing very slowly. The other is done but has no Trek content. Apparently they are waiting for Paramount to tell them it is ok to release a Trek mod. That's never going to happen. None of the fan movies or series have ever gotten permission to do their stuff. They were just told they would be sued if they charged for it. So, we are left with one going so slow it might not ever get done, and one that has been done for quite a while but isn't going to be released. Just a little disappointing after the excitement I had hearing of these projects a couple of years ago.

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Post by Malvoisin » Sat Nov 07, 2009 3:08 am

hm, if 8000 are enough nowadays (with all those cheap large-market console titles) I don't know. Money can be earned easier and faster than having a large team (like the one Microprose needed to do botf and they didn't even complete the game fully, not by far *looking at AI*..) cost a lot of money before the game even got released and then the uncertainty of failing again like with Microprose back then..

besides, the Phase II or ST: New Voyages fan series got permission, check their site. But you're right, we won't get the permission since European copyright law prevents that. I found that out during my researches. The people from Phase II are all from the U.S. and that's the main difference. But anyone from US or UK could follow the Phase II steps so to speak. IMHO they'd be pretty safe to mod the game and release that mod, pretty much like it's done here.

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Post by eber3 » Sat Nov 07, 2009 9:32 am

Malvoisin wrote: besides, the Phase II or ST: New Voyages fan series got permission, check their site.


http://stexpanded.wikia.com/wiki/Fan_productions
Cow Creek Films, the production company at the time for Star Trek: New Voyages, had contact with Paramount to successfully reverse a cease-and-desist order which resulted in a set of guidelines being verbally agreed on:

1. No profit can come from the film.
2. It cannot be shown in festivals or at conventions or any other venue where money is charged for admission, either directly for the film or the event itself.
3. It can only be a free download and cannot be offered in lieu of a "donation".
4. They were NOT giving permission to do the show, but rather turning a blind eye to it as long as the producers stick to the rules.

It should be borne in mind that there has never been any independent corroboration of this - Viacom has been consistently silent on the subject. However, the source, Jack Marshall, Executive Producer at the time, is considered trustworthy. What is more, the subsequent success of Star Trek: New Voyages and the prominent collaboration of ex-Paramount cast and crew would suggest that Paramount know about them and are giving their tacit permission.

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corestandeven
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Post by corestandeven » Sat Nov 07, 2009 9:49 am

I agree with Mavoisin, sadly the odds of a company getting good returns on this aren't promising.

Look at Star Trek Legacy, that was an action game, developed and published by big companies, must of had a lot of resources and money thrown at it, had reasonable graphics to appeal to the masses, and despite Star Trek having a huge fanbase (which you think should guarantee success) Legacy was ultimately a huge flop.

Also sole-PC games are not exactly safe returns for companies nowadays, as they can be pirated extremely easily compared with Xbox360/PS3. In addition, BOTF's fanbase is not a huge market and not very attractive to a business man.

The bottom line is I really cant see a BOTF 2 being a commercial success, and sadly that is what it boils down too as to whether or not it will be made. The only way we would see an official BOTF2, in my mind, is if a fan won the lottery and decided to create the game, knowing that he/she would make a loss, but the odds of that happening are extremely remote.

Also the other thing to consider is would a offical BOTF2 really be what we all would want?

Firstly to compete with the popular real-time strategies I think a BOTF2 would need to be dumbed down, which I know I certainly wouldn’t want! I say this because critics of BOTF back in 1999 often cited its complexity as being a huge turn-off. A BOTF2 would almost certainly not be what die-hard fans would want.
If you look at the Fallout series as an example, a lot of die-hard fanboys of Fallout1/2 (not me though) generally can’t stand Fallout 3, for a multitude of reasons granted, but I’d say most boil down to it being as simple as Fallout 3 being first person! I can see similar issues with a modern and updated BOTF, it almost certainly would get a backlash from die-hard fans if done ‘incorrectly’ in their eyes.

Secondly, I’m sure Paramount would be very keen on a having a game like this that encompasses ALL the Star Trek productions. Whilst I’m sure many wouldn’t mind aspects of Star Trek 11 being incorporated in any game, would fans react so well to having ‘Enterprise’ aspects in it? Given the hostility some have towards Enterprise I’d suspect not.

I don’t want to sound like I’m against this, I’m not, but I do think you will be disappointed. I do wish you the best of luck though, as I’d be extremely happy if this was taken forward officially and would be one of the first to place a pre-order! :D

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Post by Malvoisin » Sat Nov 07, 2009 10:32 am

http://phase2trek.com/
WELCOME TO THE UNDISCOVERED MIRROR SITE !!!

LEGAL NOTICE: Viacom, parent corporation for Paramount Studios and CBS, Inc., owns all copyright, trademark, wordmark, and servicemark references to Star Trek. However, a creative commons agreement exists between Paramount Studios and the Star Trek Phase II fan-film project. This project is allowed the limited right to distribute fan-film episode files on the understanding that no profit is to be made by anyone connected to the project. Further, these files are made available for private non-commercial viewing only and must NEVER be sold or traded in any format or on any medium. Also, unauthorized tampering, altering, or creating of derivative works from the episodes, or any images or audio contained therein is strictly prohibited and subject to severe civil and criminal penalties under the law.

This fan-film project has existed since 2004 with Paramount's blessing. Don't do anything stupid, please.

If anyone has any questions regarding the legality of files on this site, we invite you to contact the Senior Director for Licensing at Paramount Studios, Larry McCallister, at 323.956.5184 (voice) or 323.862.2231 (fax).

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Post by Darth_Windu » Sat Nov 07, 2009 2:02 pm

Go for it Jean!

I'd also suggest maybe spicing up BotF as well, similar to 'Sins of a Solar Empire' and 'Star Wars Empire at War'. Basically make the graphics and interface far, far more high-tech, and perhaps make the tactical battles more...well...tactical and dull down the strategic options (ie micromanaging every single system).

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