Feedback needed

Supremacy; support/discussion/questions

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Hebrewhammer
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Re: Feedback needed

Post by Hebrewhammer »

I know this a month old, however I'm not sure what race you would be comparing the federation ships to for balancing. I don't mind seeing game balance but removing one torpedo launcher from most fed ships is a big damage decrease.

The romulans may have slightly weaker ships but their torpedoes do more damage and they have the first strike capability with their cloaking which alone is a big advantage.

The dominion scouts and fast attack ships are out gunned, but their battle ships and battle cruisers have 100-200 more shielding then the fed equivalent and double or almost double the torpedo launchers.

The cardasians are slightly below the federation in about every aspect, however they are a more mass production type of ship play style. Maybe further reduce build and maintenance cost so they can field more units to over come the disparity in ship power.

The klingons are kind of in the same boat as the romulans, they might have a 100 less shields then the feds however they have the first strike capability with the cloak and they carry more weapons then the federations ships.

If your looking to tone down the federations ship damage, maybe just slightly reduce the the damage of their torpedoes then completely removing one launcher from their ships.

I guess the real issue is the chances of other races equivalent ships winning in a 1 v 1 fight. As in pitting cruisers against cruisers and see if the feds always win in that scenario. I would think the cloak would be a big advantage over the 80 or 100 more shields the feds have. Then again I'm not sure how the shield number applies when taking damage from other ships.
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Re: Feedback needed

Post by Iceman »

Hebrewhammer wrote: Mon Sep 13, 2021 10:55 pm I know this a month old
Oh, there's no expiration date on any of the issues mentioned here :wink:
The purpose of this thread is to have people chime in when they feel confortable enough with the game to produce an opinion.
All feedback is extremely appreciated. Thanks!

I don't mind seeing game balance but removing one torpedo launcher from most fed ships is a big damage decrease.
The rationale was that since they have more staying power (higher hulls and shields, and shield regen) than everyone else - and they have more ship types and classes, including the Tactical Cruiser - maybe they should have less firepower. Add to that that "cannonically" the Feds are more focused on exploration than warfare (hence the higher defenses). Basically, the opposite of the Klingons.
I guess that their Heavy Destroyers would be left out of this reduction, so that they have a true "brawler" option for times of war. The Strike Cruisers are a glaring example: a peace loving civ like the Feds have them as effective as any other empire, AND they have the tier 3 STK which the Klingons and the Cardassians (and the Dominion because they have none) do not!! It's kind of silly. Making them a bit weaker would balance things out a bit.

A lateral but important consideration is that the Feds are just too good - in diplomacy, in research, in the economy, in colonization, etc. They should suck at something :twisted:
To match other empires' fleet power, they should need more ships, costing more upkeep, cutting into their economy. Or build stations for defense, and OBs - since they "should" have a more defensive playstyle.

The cardasians are slightly below the federation in about every aspect, however they are a more mass production type of ship play style. Maybe further reduce build and maintenance cost so they can field more units to over come the disparity in ship power.
That's an idea, yes. Don't forget though that their ships have heavy phasers, that deal 10% more damage than their standard version.

BTW, I'm in the process of tweaking the Cardassian civilian ships, changing their hulls to standard values instead of the higher values of their warships. It makes them more prone to duranium shortages.
I'm also going to increase their colony ships' starting pop (and the Klingons') to the standard value, following feedback from geordie.

If your looking to tone down the federations ship damage, maybe just slightly reduce the the damage of their torpedoes then completely removing one launcher from their ships.
Do we want to open that "why are the federation's torpedoes crappier than everyone else's" can of worms? :twisted:

I guess the real issue is the chances of other races equivalent ships winning in a 1 v 1 fight. As in pitting cruisers against cruisers and see if the feds always win in that scenario. I would think the cloak would be a big advantage over the 80 or 100 more shields the feds have.
I once did something like that, but I just don't have the time to do extensive testing to get to real conclusions.
One way to do this testing is to edit HomeSystems.xml, and for any/each starting tech level, replace the default ships with the fleet composition you want to test - for each empire. Then start a new game, Tiny or Small galaxy, AIMode set to Normal. Use F12 to see where another empire is (one that you have edited the starting ships), and move your fleet there. Declare war first (use a scout for 1st contact, or wait a turn after contact), so that they don't hail.
This allows you to quickly change the test from 10v10 cruisers to say 20v20 cruisers, or any other settings.

Then again I'm not sure how the shield number applies when taking damage from other ships.
Very straight forward approach. Damage is applied to the shields, they regenerate at the end of each combat round, and when they're depleted they won't regenerate any more, and damage is applied directly to the hull.
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Re: Feedback needed

Post by Iceman »

In the late game when playing the larger galaxies, when the player's colony count exceeds some 250, the Assets screen starts throwing Out Of Memory exceptions when trying to draw all those star system displays in the Colonies tab.

So here's the question.
Is it useful, to have the star system display *in the Colonies* tab?

In the Star Systems tab, it might be useful, to help you decide which system to prioritize for colonization, based on its composition (if you are short on some resource, for instance); so I guess it is justified to display it there.

In the Colonies tab, it might not be that useful? I don't usually pay any attention to it, it is just visually nice, and makes this view a little less "spreadsheet"-like. Maybe leaving the system resources (dilithium, duranium) icons only?
Removing the star system display would allow spreading the colony's info along the rest of the (now empty) line, making each colony take less (vertical) space to display, and thus shortening the length of the colony list - which is another issue when you have lots of colonies. It would also make turn processing faster, and loading the Assets screen Colonies tab a lot faster.

So, what do you guys think?
Do you have any suggestions? Redesigning the Colonies tab?

This only really becomes an issue usually in Huge galaxies (particularly in Dense), late game, when the player has lots of colonies.
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Hebrewhammer
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Re: Feedback needed

Post by Hebrewhammer »

Iceman wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 7:30 am So here's the question.
Is it useful, to have the star system display *in the Colonies* tab?
I'm good either way, to be honest the main aids I use are the summary tab after each turn and the system screen. When doing mass upgrades on colonies I just use the arrow keys and work my way down the colonies list (though this takes awhile in huge maps I like being thorough). I rarely use the colonies tab for reference. So removing the star system display to help with the loading and memory issue of huge maps seems fine with me, however others may rely on this tab more then I do.

By the way I like the name of the temporary fix for the huge galaxy maps :grin:
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Re: Feedback needed

Post by Iceman »

:lol:
Yup, that was for you only, it's not an official patch. I'll take it down now.
(Though it does have some AI improvements, still under testing :wink: )

Thanks for the feedback!
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