Envoy related crash

[Warp Core Breach]

Hi Team,
So, years ago I bought BotF... and hated it. I was able to "trade it in" for a 5 buck credit, and even though I paid a fair bit more, I thought myself lucky. More recently, I found a link that brought me to the BofF site, where I stumbled upon Supremacy. Decided what the heck, and downloaded. Very glad I did! Had a blast playing "old school" Klingons (made friends with Romulans, attacked Feds on sight). Finally invaded Sol, and then the game crashed. :-(

Poked around and found the error logs:

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Object reference not set to an instance of an object.

at Supremacy.Personnel.AgentPool.TrainAgents() in C:\Projects\Supremacy\Mainline\SupremacyCore\Personnel\AgentPool.cs:line 132
at Supremacy.Personnel.AgentPool.Update() in C:\Projects\Supremacy\Mainline\SupremacyCore\Personnel\AgentPool.cs:line 67
at Supremacy.Game.GameEngine.DoPersonnel(GameContext game) in C:\Projects\Supremacy\Mainline\SupremacyCore\Game\GameEngine.cs:line 1663
at Supremacy.Game.GameEngine.DoTurn(GameContext game) in C:\Projects\Supremacy\Mainline\SupremacyCore\Game\GameEngine.cs:line 313
at Supremacy.WCF.SupremacyService.<>c__DisplayClass53_0.<DoTurnCore>b__0() in C:\Projects\Supremacy\Mainline\SupremacyService\SupremacyService.cs:line 638
at System.Linq.Observable.<>c__DisplayClass130.<>c__DisplayClass132.<ToAsync>b__12f()

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I was playing SupremacyTest_20210113 version with the patch_20211012 applied. I also installed the Nov 1 patch and then restarted from a savegame, but still had the same problem after invading Sol. If I don't invade, the game progresses to next turn ok. If I then invade, the crash happens after that.

I'm playing Windows 10/64, and I have all the prereq software installed. Game played great for over 200 turns! No crashes, no problems.

Let me know if you need any additional info to troubleshoot.

(going to see if I can assimilate the galaxy now. resistance is futile!)

[Iceman]

Hi Team,

Hi Warp Core Breach.
Welcome to the forums!

So, years ago I bought BotF... and hated it. I was able to "trade it in" for a 5 buck credit, and even though I paid a fair bit more, I thought myself lucky. More recently, I found a link that brought me to the BofF site, where I stumbled upon Supremacy. Decided what the heck, and downloaded. Very glad I did! Had a blast playing "old school" Klingons (made friends with Romulans, attacked Feds on sight).

It's great that you found Supremacy, and really enjoyed playing it!

Finally invaded Sol, and then the game crashed. :-(

Some would say that you shouldn't have invaded Sol... not me though
Seriously though, I've split your post from the other thread into a new one, as this issue is not directly related to Win10, but it is a bug related to envoys. I hope you don't mind me taking that liberty.

I was playing SupremacyTest_20210113 version with the patch_20211012 applied. I also installed the Nov 1 patch and then restarted from a savegame, but still had the same problem after invading Sol. If I don't invade, the game progresses to next turn ok. If I then invade, the crash happens after that.

Thanks for the logs! Can you attach a savegame where I can test the fix, before releasing it in a patch? Thanks!

Game played great for over 200 turns! No crashes, no problems.

(going to see if I can assimilate the galaxy now. resistance is futile!)

LOL.
BTW, playing as the Borg is not yet a fully developed experience, still needs some work. Any feedback you can provide (about anything in the game, really) is greatly appreciated!
Thanks for your report, and for playing Supremacy!

[Warp Core Breach]

Hi Iceman,
Thanks for the welcome! I've attached the .sav file here. I'm happy to install a patch and be a playtester as well, if it would help.

Borg mode is going ok! My biggest complaint is that I can't tell how big a garrison I can assimilate. If I have, say, 3 Spheres, how big of a garrison can that overcome? Is it just garrison size, or does population count too? The description seems to imply that a Diamond is the most useful for assimilation. Is it better than the more expensive Cubes? I will say, there's a kinda creepy vibe to all the empty systems in my space that are useless to the Borg. Feels about right!

A couple of other questions/thoughts/suggestions:
1. If I conquer a minor race (as a non-Borg), do I lose the ability to build that race's special building? Feels like a huge disadvantage for a military strategy.

2. Finding it a minor annoyance that I can't put a building and it's upgrade in the build queue at the same time. I'd like, for example to be able to queue up 2 farms and farm upgrade early on in a new colony, so I can just forget about it for a while.

3. I'm guessing diplomatic options are still in development. I never wanted to be allied with the Romulans, but they grew to like me so much, they offered me an alliance, and I didn't have the ability to decline. Not liking that they're now colonizing the marginal systems in my space that I hadn't gotten to colonizing yet. Also not clear why some systems within my "borders" are not considered in my space. Lots of "holes" in my territory!

Only on my second game, so lots that I haven't explored yet - ex. espionage. In both of my games, the Cardassians have fared poorly, even despite my not encountering them. Maybe I'll try them next.

Thanks for all the work!

Envoy Crash upon Sol Invasion.sav

(817.41 KiB) Downloaded 78 times

[Warp Core Breach]

Oh, one other thought! The Klingon music from ST:TMP is one of best, imho. Any way I can swap it with the music on the galaxy screen or colony screen because, right now, I almost never go to the screen where it comes up!

[Iceman]

Hi Iceman,
Thanks for the welcome! I've attached the .sav file here. I'm happy to install a patch and be a playtester as well, if it would help.

Thanks for the save, the crash is fixed I'll upload a new patch shortly.

Sure, we need all the help we can get, including with testing. Crash logs, bug reports, suggestions for improvements, it's all helpful.
I've noticed in your game that even though you're at war with the Feds, relations with them are positive... need to look into that. How did that war start? Any info you can provide can help.
The colony management AI seems to have done a rather decent job in Sol, though the Feds are lagging behind in tech relative to you (TL5 vs TL7); not sure if some empires having access to their Simulators sooner (Card and Kling at TL5 vs rest at TL6) might be a determining factor.

Borg mode is going ok! My biggest complaint is that I can't tell how big a garrison I can assimilate. If I have, say, 3 Spheres, how big of a garrison can that overcome? Is it just garrison size, or does population count too? The description seems to imply that a Diamond is the most useful for assimilation. Is it better than the more expensive Cubes?

Yes, there is a problem with conveying that information - though I have tried to make it as simple as possible. Basically, a fleet's assimilation capability is equal to its combined Crew value (warships only) divided by 10 (which corresponds to the ships' real crew complement divided by 1000). Each Cube is worth 64, and each Diamond 50; the description might be misleading here, I guess.
You only need to overcome the garrison, not the population.

I will say, there's a kinda creepy vibe to all the empty systems in my space that are useless to the Borg. Feels about right!

A couple of other questions/thoughts/suggestions:
1. If I conquer a minor race (as a non-Borg), do I lose the ability to build that race's special building? Feels like a huge disadvantage for a military strategy.

Yes. We're discussing this topic here, trying to make both options more balanced. Any input you may want to share would be useful.
We may need to revert that design decision at some point, if there's no way to make them both useful.

2. Finding it a minor annoyance that I can't put a building and it's upgrade in the build queue at the same time. I'd like, for example to be able to queue up 2 farms and farm upgrade early on in a new colony, so I can just forget about it for a while.

Not sure why it is so. I mean, it was a design decision, just not sure why it was made. Will have to look at the code, and see if there is a reason for it to be like that.

3. I'm guessing diplomatic options are still in development. I never wanted to be allied with the Romulans, but they grew to like me so much, they offered me an alliance, and I didn't have the ability to decline. Not liking that they're now colonizing the marginal systems in my space that I hadn't gotten to colonizing yet.

Yes, that's one of the things in diplomacy that's still not implemented - Accept/Reject/Counter a proposal. It's partly implemented, but still a WiP. For now, human players are bound by the same code that the AI uses to consider proposals - so in fact it's the AI that's making the decisions for you.
Since the AI now makes proposals, the Roms thought it would be nice to ally with you. I was actually looking at that code last night, and made a couple of notes about the Romulans and the Klingons offering alliances - just need to turn them into actual code

Also not clear why some systems within my "borders" are not considered in my space. Lots of "holes" in my territory!

It has to do with population in your systems. The more population a colony has, the larger (radius) the territory it claims around it.
If you want to claim a system that's not within that radius, build an outpost there. That way, no one can claim/colonize it.

Only on my second game, so lots that I haven't explored yet - ex. espionage. In both of my games, the Cardassians have fared poorly, even despite my not encountering them. Maybe I'll try them next.

Intelligence is not working yet. There's some code for it, but I have it disabled, as it sometimes can be very punishing
I'll try to work on it again when I find the time.
I'll look into the Cardassians, to see if there's something holding them back. Their support ships now have the same general duranium costs as the rest of the empires, so that shouldn't be a cause for shortages.

Thanks for all the work!

Thanks for the feedback, and keep it coming!

[Iceman]

Oh, one other thought! The Klingon music from ST:TMP is one of best, imho. Any way I can swap it with the music on the galaxy screen or colony screen because, right now, I almost never go to the screen where it comes up!

Yes, go to \Resources\Data and edit the MusicPacks.xml file (with Notepad++).
Find the Klingon themes (line 38+) and swap the names of the themes according to the screen where you want them to be played.

Code: Select all

  <DefaultMusicPack Name="Klingons">
    <GalaxyScreen>Klingon Music.wav</GalaxyScreen>
    <ColonyScreen>Klingon Cry of the Warrior.wav</ColonyScreen>
    <DiplomacyScreen>FS2 Tribute.wav</DiplomacyScreen>
    <ScienceScreen>Portal Mastery v2.ogg</ScienceScreen>
    <IntelligenceScreen>Cirrus-March.wav</IntelligenceScreen>
    <PersonnelScreen>Klingon Systems Long Music_Inon Zur.mp3</PersonnelScreen>
  </DefaultMusicPack>

If you tell me which themes you want swapped, I can make that official
I actually have a note to swap 2 Klingon themes, it might be the same as yours.

Any other themes (any civ) you think could be swapped, just LMK and I'll make it happen.

[Warp Core Breach]

Hi Iceman!
So "Klingon Systems Long Music_Inon Zur" is the first 90 secs or so from the Klingon Battle theme from ST:TMP (would love to have all 5 mins!).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X4IG2zw ... 44&index=3

I'm putting that on the GalaxyScreen, moving "Klingon Music" to the ColonyScreen, and moving "Klingon Cry of the Warrior" to the PersonnelScreen. (Not as big a fan of this last theme vs the others.)


During the game, relations with the Feds were weird, to be sure. Before declaring war, I destroyed several of their colony ships and scout ship or two. As you'd expect, their "Regard" for the Klingons dropped down to almost 0, but weirdly "Trust" stayed at 500 the whole time (I guess they fully trusted that the Klingons would be attacking ). When I was ready, I declared war and started invading. No other communications.

One other weird diplomacy thing. The Edo were the first minor I met. just a few turns after meeting them, having taken no diplomatic actions other than hailing their protector, they offered a membership treaty. No other major power had contacted them yet either. It was a welcome bonus at that point in the game, but probably not what you're envisioning.

You mentioned that Intelligence isn't working? I do recall getting hit a couple of times, I'm guessing by the Roms (prior to alliance), actually. Worst hit was losing 3 farms, so nothing too punishing.

Btw, the queuing issue with upgrades is definitely not the most important thing to solve. Just my thoughts at the time - I'll get over it.


Thanks for the patch. Just downloaded. Looking forward to seeing what goodies I get after the invasion of Sol!

Cheers!

[Iceman]

So "Klingon Systems Long Music_Inon Zur" is the first 90 secs or so from the Klingon Battle theme from ST:TMP (would love to have all 5 mins!).

Yeah, I was reserving that one for the space battle theme for the Klingons, when there's a combat engine
If you can get the complete track, I can add it to the game.

I'm putting that on the GalaxyScreen, moving "Klingon Music" to the ColonyScreen, and moving "Klingon Cry of the Warrior" to the PersonnelScreen. (Not as big a fan of this last theme vs the others.)

Will do.

During the game, relations with the Feds were weird, to be sure. Before declaring war, I destroyed several of their colony ships and scout ship or two. As you'd expect, their "Regard" for the Klingons dropped down to almost 0,

Ah, I think I might know what happened. Those events produce a temporary Regard penalty IIRC. When you declared war, Regard was already zero, so the permanent Regard penalty for the DoW didn't have any effect. Will fix, thanks!

Any other civ would have declared war on you for destroying their colony ships, but the Feds need a really big incentive. Should I increase the effect for destroying colony ships for the Feds?

but weirdly "Trust" stayed at 500 the whole time (I guess they fully trusted that the Klingons would be attacking ).

Trust has to do with keeping agreements and stuff like that; if you don't respect a Cease-Fire, or don't comply with a Mutual Defense request, etc. The Klingons are too honourable to do that kind of devious things.
It will eventually affect Regard in a small measure.

When I was ready, I declared war and started invading. No other communications.

There's still a lot of areas where diplomacy can be enhanced. So much to do, so little time...

One other weird diplomacy thing. The Edo were the first minor I met. just a few turns after meeting them, having taken no diplomatic actions other than hailing their protector, they offered a membership treaty. No other major power had contacted them yet either. It was a welcome bonus at that point in the game, but probably not what you're envisioning.

Peaceful and Pacifist minors will do that, offer to become members (a few turns after contact); at this point IIRC there aren't any (other) conditions for that to happen, we need to work on that. It should probably have to do with the traits of both civs, but for now this was meant to help the AI a bit with getting minors to join (the AI doesn't yet know how to offer gifts) - we also don't want to give the Feds AI an(other) advantage.

A couple of questions derived from your comment:
- should the Edo be an exception in minors offering to become members (using the station as a condition)?
- should minors only offer to become members if they have met more than one empire (selecting the best option)?
- any suggestions on how to improve this?

You mentioned that Intelligence isn't working? I do recall getting hit a couple of times, I'm guessing by the Roms (prior to alliance), actually. Worst hit was losing 3 farms, so nothing too punishing.

That was actually a terrorism event.
For now, those might trigger in colonies where Intel production is low. Since Intel is not working yet, these terrorism events are meant to "force" you to assign pop to Intel, so that research doesn't spiral out of control - and to make Intel somewhat useful while it is not properly implemented. Low pop colonies are exempt from terrorism events, as otherwise they would be much less useful. All colonies benefit from a "grace period" of 50 turns before people start getting ideas I have posted about a new approach to this here.

Btw, the queuing issue with upgrades is definitely not the most important thing to solve. Just my thoughts at the time - I'll get over it.

Thanks for the patch. Just downloaded. Looking forward to seeing what goodies I get after the invasion of Sol!

Some of those goodies will get destroyed in the invasion (by design), namely the unique buildings But this can be modded.

Thanks!

[Warp Core Breach]

hi Iceman,
The complete track, zip'ed, is over 10MB, so I'm not able to upload it. Any other way for me to get it to you?

Some other thoughts, that i'll post in a message. Borg are way overpowered, I think....

[thunderchero]

The complete track, zip'ed, is over 10MB, so I'm not able to upload it. Any other way for me to get it to you?

If you have a gmail account you could upload to your google drive?

[Iceman]

I'm wondering if this track being played in the galaxy screen, where you spend a lot of time, won't get too tiring after a while?

[Iceman]

2. Finding it a minor annoyance that I can't put a building and it's upgrade in the build queue at the same time. I'd like, for example to be able to queue up 2 farms and farm upgrade early on in a new colony, so I can just forget about it for a while.

This probably has to do with the calculation of the build cost for the upgrade. Adding more farms to the build queue requires recalculating the total cost. Shouldn't be too hard to do, but I'm not sure if there are other issues involved.

[Iceman]

Ah, I think I might know what happened. Those events produce a temporary Regard penalty IIRC. When you declared war, Regard was already zero, so the permanent Regard penalty for the DoW didn't have any effect. Will fix, thanks!

Should be fixed now, but needs to be tested.

[Iceman]

hi Iceman,
The complete track, zip'ed, is over 10MB, so I'm not able to upload it. Any other way for me to get it to you?

Sent you a PM yesterday about this.



---

I never wanted to be allied with the Romulans, but they grew to like me so much, they offered me an alliance, and I didn't have the ability to decline.

How did they end up liking you so much? I mean, what did you do to get to that?

[Warp Core Breach]

Hi Iceman,

How did they end up liking you so much? I mean, what did you do to get to that?

I formed an Open Borders treaty, then spent all my available trade routes (5-6) with them (stupidly, I should add, as I didn't have any to use with minors as a result... ) . I probably had close to 200 credits per turn in trade with them. I left things at that, but I'm guessing that over time, all that trade won them over. They bumped things up to Affiliation and then Alliance.

I've emailed you the track. Let me know if you have any issues unzipping the 3-part file. Given it's length, I think it would be less tiring compared to other tracks. Unless you can rotate the music, that'll be an issue no matter which you choose, I would think.

Just downloaded the latest patch. I'll start a new game and see if I can test the diplomatic penalties for attacking ships.

Any other civ would have declared war on you for destroying their colony ships, but the Feds need a really big incentive. Should I increase the effect for destroying colony ships for the Feds?

My vote is "no". No reason to make life easier for the Feds.

A couple of questions derived from your comment:
- should the Edo be an exception in minors offering to become members (using the station as a condition)?
- should minors only offer to become members if they have met more than one empire (selecting the best option)?
- any suggestions on how to improve this?

I like that different minors have different reactions to learning there are bigger, badder players in the galaxy! I haven't seen enough of them to say that this should be changed. Minors like the Kelleruns and Nausicaans (i.e Warlike, Raider) should be more predisposed to liking Klingons, and other minors more predisposed to each of the other major powers based on personality similarities. Regarding the Edo specifically, they have their caretaker in orbit, so I'd think they'd be less predisposed to everyone, but if it helps with balance (or coding simplicity), I don't think this is a major issue.