Supremacy new release

Supremacy; support/discussion/questions

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Iceman
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Re: Supremacy new release

Post by Iceman »

Re-uploaded the patch, so that now ignoring a proposal will have the exact same effects as rejecting it - we should probably discuss (again) how we should differentiate these 2.
It should also fix this:
2. If I use a threat of war in my demand and the message is ignored, the war is also 'ignored'.
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Spocks-cuddly-tribble
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Re: Supremacy new release

Post by Spocks-cuddly-tribble »

Iceman wrote: Fri May 19, 2023 6:22 pmignoring a proposal will have the exact same effects as rejecting it - we should probably discuss (again) how we should differentiate these 2.
I think in BotF this only differs via the morale table event 'reject treaty' i.e. by default 'ignore' is the better option for cardassians, federation and ferengi.

I'm not sure whether the 'reject treaty' morale effect also includes minor race treaties and alliance proposals?

The AI will ignore proposals only if it proposes something at the same turn to the same empire.
I don't know how many bugs is too many but that point is reached somewhere before however many in BotF is.
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geordie
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Re: Supremacy new release

Post by geordie »

Ops.... something went wrong. To be more precise the replacement of an ignored treaty by its rejection went too deep and I got all my proposals and even ALL my existing treaties rejected :( However the Diplomacy Screen looks OK. There are some strange responses listed looking like my ones.
The next turn the full list of rejected treaties appeared in the sitrep again rejected. :sad:
Definitely I used the last patch, after the re-upload.
SP Cardassians Huge Irregular 317.zip
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Iceman
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Re: Supremacy new release

Post by Iceman »

Sorry for taking so long to reply, guys, I was away for a couple of days.
geordie wrote: Sat May 20, 2023 5:36 pm Ops.... something went wrong. To be more precise the replacement of an ignored treaty by its rejection went too deep and I got all my proposals and even ALL my existing treaties rejected :( However the Diplomacy Screen looks OK. There are some strange responses listed looking like my ones.
The next turn the full list of rejected treaties appeared in the sitrep again rejected. :sad:
I know what the problem is, should be easy to fix. It is inconvenient, but shouldn't affect gameplay. Thanks!
I already took down the patch, will upload a new one later today.


Spocks-cuddly-tribble wrote: Fri May 19, 2023 8:13 pm
Iceman wrote: Fri May 19, 2023 6:22 pmignoring a proposal will have the exact same effects as rejecting it - we should probably discuss (again) how we should differentiate these 2.
I think in BotF this only differs via the morale table event 'reject treaty' i.e. by default 'ignore' is the better option for cardassians, federation and ferengi.
Makes it a bit odd, I think.
When I was implementing this, I thought about something like
- rejecting would trigger the Morale effect, but not the Regard effect
- ignoring would trigger the Regard effect, but not the Morale effect

I'm not sure whether the 'reject treaty' morale effect also includes minor race treaties and alliance proposals?
You mean in BotF or Supremacy ?

The AI will ignore proposals only if it proposes something at the same turn to the same empire.
Simultaneous proposals, then. :up:
How does the game determine which of the 2 simultaneous proposals is ignored ? By whichever empire is processed first ? Or by the "level" of treaties being proposed ?
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Re: Supremacy new release

Post by Spocks-cuddly-tribble »

Iceman wrote: Mon May 22, 2023 2:06 pmYou mean in BotF or Supremacy ?

How does the game determine which of the 2 simultaneous proposals is ignored ? By whichever empire is processed first ? Or by the "level" of treaties being proposed ?
1.) BotF

2.) I'm not certain for AI vs AI simultaneous proposals (both might get ignored).

Player proposals get a message next turn "AI X ignored proposal Y from Z", but the player has still the option to accept the AI proposal.

I never tested simultaneous proposals in BotF multiplayer, either the better treaty takes effect or the order in OrdInfo just insta-cancels the first (lower item ID) treaty with the next one (like simultaneous conquests in BotF :evil: :dwn: ).
I don't know how many bugs is too many but that point is reached somewhere before however many in BotF is.
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Re: Supremacy new release

Post by Iceman »

IIRC it is Reject Peace Treaty, but it is not very clear what peace means in the context.


New patch with the fix is up.
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Re: Supremacy new release

Post by Iceman »

Sorry guys, there were some other issues with this topic, I took the patch down (again... :oops: )
I think I have it nailed now, along with the issue where you would not get incoming messages for rejected and ignored proposals; but I haven't tested this last part when the player has rejected/ignored an AI proposal yet (they shouldn't get an incoming message ofc).
While fixing this, I noticed some other issues when accepting proposals, which I'll try to address asap.
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Re: Supremacy new release

Post by geordie »

Waiting for resolving the diplomacy problems I started a Borg game.
It went pretty smoothly, but today I got a repeatable error/hang of not resolved combat. I assume it is AI fight.
Screenshot 20230524.jpg
Screenshot 20230524.jpg (560.86 KiB) Viewed 201 times
If it does not appear immediately it should happen next turn.
SP Borg Huge Irregular 530.zip
(1.14 MiB) Downloaded 2 times
@Iceman - let me know if you need anything to be checked in the Borg game.
The speed of fleet support increase is slow, but acceptable with current AI aggressiveness
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Re: Supremacy new release

Post by Iceman »

Yep, it's an AI vs AI battle, more precisely a couple of Scimitars and a couple other Rom ships vs a Klingon colony ship. The cause was this change:
Iceman wrote: Sat May 13, 2023 5:52 pm Tactical Cruisers now have a special ability: they can target multiple ships at once.
It's fixed now, thanks!
Please check if there aren't any unintended consequences in space battles.

Do you think fleet support for the Borg should be changed :?: If so, any suggestions ?
Anything that you feel is not right or should be changed, please report.
Empires don't gang up on the Borg yet. Do they put up a fight individually?


New patch.

Besides the diplomacy problems mentioned above, some changes in accepting a proposal:
- some fixes for particular situations
- Open Borders no longer grants the SignPeaceTreaty morale effect (neither RejectPeaceTreaty when rejected)
- the threshold for bribed minor civs breaking their membership treaties now depends on the minor's trait (vs the sovereign empire's trait in some cases)

Rejecting a proposal hasn't changed (morale effect, small regard penalty).
Ignoring a proposal has no effect but has a large regard penalty.

Feedback appreciated!
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Re: Supremacy new release

Post by geordie »

I have again the 'Resolving combat" problem.
SP Borg Huge Irregular 640.zip
(1.23 MiB) Downloaded 1 time
Just to press 'turn' is enough to get it.
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Re: Supremacy new release

Post by Iceman »

Same issue, but this time vs a station (OP II).
Fixed it, but I need to improve the code vs stations before releasing a new patch. Stay tuned!
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Re: Supremacy new release

Post by Iceman »

New patch.
The AI should be a bit more on the offense now.
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Re: Supremacy new release

Post by the6the »

Iceman wrote: Wed May 24, 2023 5:44 pm
Empires don't gang up on the Borg yet. Do they put up a fight individually?
Perhaps only civs (minor or major) that have
a) made contact with the Borg,
+
b) crossed a certain threshold of lost resources in the fight against them (certain amount/combo of ships/stations/colonies)

can propose a specific anti-Borg war pact treaty with other civs known to them, that have also made contact with the Borg. The probability of success of the treaty should then depend on how many resources were lost by the treaty proposal receiver (in my book, regardless of the trust/regard status between the two!)

This is probably difficult to code, but would make sense to me
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